N18 Book of Peril troubles

GraaEminense

Four-armed Emperor
Jan 12, 2015
180
137
73
Bergen, Norway
So I have read through Book of Peril. I like it a lot, there are many good ideas, but there's still no one proofreading anything at SG HQ.

1) Venators. Choosing your own skills and statline, easy access to BS3+ and BS2+... aren't these just a little too good, and aren't some of the statlines just plain better than the others? They get special bounty rules and legacy rules for the price of... not being able to hire nameless bounty hunters, and not getting special weapon gangers. Since they're all unarmoured they even get to not pay the Gang Rating Tax when they upgrade their armour. Apart from that, the actual flaw is how their trade rules are supposed to work -they're easily abused unless an arbitrator essentially houserules them.

2) Guild Alliances. They give a bonus, and some drawbacks. Drawbacks can be ignored by risking losing the alliance, which carries no other cost than losing the bonus (and not having to worry about the drawbacks) for a cycle. There's no reason not to! They're somewhat balanced out (for low-ranked gangs) by losing access to the House Favours (and House Sub Plots), but these are presented as Arbitrator tools. Unless there's an Arbitrator that allows House Favours to be used every game, a gang should always be allied to a Guild.

3) Guild representatives. How many goons are there? Who knows. Why do they all have to be so weirdly equipped? Who's going to build and paint more than one of these groups?

4) Guild of Iron. Their bonus completely breaks the economy (5c boltgun!) AND you can use normal scum as their representatives. Why would you ever choose another guild?

5) Hired Guns. This is an old complaint, but whyyyy do you call it a laspistol if it doesn't follow the rules for one?

6) Brainleaf Zombies. They're not part of a gang, when do they activate and who decides how they act? And does the Brainleaf Outbreak essentially protect those going OOA from having to roll for injury?

So, yes. I'm sure there are more, but those are my current annoyances with what's basically a lot of good stuff badly written.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Baffo and Ben_S

MusingWarboss

Gang Hero
Oct 31, 2013
1,024
2,387
123
Brainleaf Zombies. They're not part of a gang, when do they activate and who decides how they act?
Probably shouldn't answer as I've no idea not having the book ... but... unless there's some rule you've missed they're probably controlled by the Arbitrator they keep referring to. It seems to be a thing, if they don't specify then the Arbitrator decides. In this case they sound like NPCs.

But don't listen to my uninformed waffling, wait until you get a proper answer from someone like keeper of the YAQ Thorgor. He'll know.
 
  • Like
Reactions: spafe

Vonvilkee

Gang Hero
Jan 7, 2018
587
413
78
Bellingham, Washington USA
Any player can activate them, removing the zombie's ready marker and controlling them that turn... Makes it a choice of when to use your initiative and your gangs models.

This would be my call to avoid needing a third party every time...
 

GraaEminense

Four-armed Emperor
Jan 12, 2015
180
137
73
Bergen, Norway
Probably shouldn't answer as I've no idea not having the book ... but... unless there's some rule you've missed they're probably controlled by the Arbitrator they keep referring to. It seems to be a thing, if they don't specify then the Arbitrator decides. In this case they sound like NPCs.
Yeah, except these turn up in rules that should not require a third player. Played one of the new scenarios last night (Escape the Badzones) and suddenly we were up to our necks in zombies with no one to run them.

Any player can activate them, removing the zombie's ready marker and controlling them that turn... Makes it a choice of when to use your initiative and your gangs models.
Given that half the time it's beneficial to not use your initiative (because it's safer after the other player runs out of activations), I'm not sure how well this works in practice. We ended up rolling for each zombie at the start of the End phase with the high roller moving it, which was unneccessarily clunky.
 

Thorgor

Of The YAQ
Oct 12, 2015
2,997
6,498
138
34
Issy-les-Moulineaux 92130 France
The stats and rules for Brainleaf zombies are in a brown box labelled "in arbitrated scenarios" that states they are controlled by the arbitrator.
There doesn't seem to be any instruction anywhere for playing zombies in non-arbitrated scenarios, even if you can still roll the brainleaf outbreak event... so the zombies will just stay there looking stupid and having no stats until the battle ends and they go in recovery (kinda similar to being webbed, except you only get one chance to recover with a flesh wound).
Gosh, that's dumb.

edit: hmm, I can't see anything that states fighters who become zombies stop being part of the gang. It seems you keep controlling them as normal, they just get new stats and special rules.
I wonder if they count as SI/OoA for the purpose of bottle tests, or if they count as Standing for the purpose of Nerve tests...
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Vonvilkee

Vonvilkee

Gang Hero
Jan 7, 2018
587
413
78
Bellingham, Washington USA
Okay once I'm able to get to the book I will.

@GraaEminense while you are correct it is good to "pass" if both players are able to activate them it won't be that many passes... As both players use activations to move zombies around. It just adds another layer forcing cool to shoot past them clogging movement etc
 

GraaEminense

Four-armed Emperor
Jan 12, 2015
180
137
73
Bergen, Norway
edit: hmm, I can't see anything that state fighters who become zombies stop being part of the gang. It seems you keep controlling them as normal, they just get new stats and special rules.
I wonder if they count as SI/OoA for the purpose of bottle tests, or if they count as Standing for the purpose of Nerve tests...
Soooo since zombies are very hard to kill and the only injury you get from being a zombie is going into recovery... would getting intentionally infected be a way to keep vulnerable fighters safe for the long run?

It's pretty obvious that they are supposed to be zombies and eat everyone. The rules don't really support using them at all, though.
 

Thorgor

Of The YAQ
Oct 12, 2015
2,997
6,498
138
34
Issy-les-Moulineaux 92130 France
I think the intent is for zombified fighters to go in recovery only if they survive the battle as zombies. If they go OoA again as a zombie, they should probably roll for lasting injuries as normal.
What I find hilarious, if zombies are still part of the gang, is that having a zombified friendly fighter nearby can still help you pass nerve tests or put the fire out when ablaze. Zombie friends are best friends!
 

spafe

Executive Officer in charge of Hats
Staff member
Necromunda Custodian
Yak Comp 2nd Place
Tribe Council
Feb 8, 2013
9,252
11,969
283
Tilehurst, U.k.
If they go OoA again as a zombie, they should probably roll for lasting injuries as normal.
that is my reading of it from a quick look last night. If they finish the battle 'alive and well', then they'll be going into recovery as that is at the 'end of the game', however if they are taken ooa during the game, you roll their lasting injury at the time, so there's nothing to resolve 'at the end of the game'
 
  • Like
Reactions: Thorgor

Dertrend

Juve
Jan 27, 2014
35
21
8
New Westminster BC
I had a brainleaf zombie outbreak in a game recently and we had a random observer jump in and play / RP the zombies for fun. As long as they basically attack the nearest ganger and the zombie controller actual tries to replicate expected zombie behaviour I think this is the best solution.
 
Apr 4, 2018
218
184
48
Bristol, UK
I have many an issue with sentries, but yes.

Sentries have the issue that they're supposed to be played by one player, meaning they need to be engaging and fun. (Or at least, are meant to be).
Unlike zombies.
 

Mordian7th

New Member
Aug 8, 2018
1
17
13
Niwot, Colorado, USA
We've been doing a zombie infestation in the recent local campaign, and for non-arbitrated scenarios in the end phase all the zombies each move 2d6" towards the closest ganger to the model regardless of cover or LoS (the zombies can smell 'em), and if they move into base-to-base contact they count as charging. We also rule they ignore pinning from shooting (they don't take cover), and ignore flesh wounds on the injury dice (minor grazes don't bother 'em). A serious injury roll knocks them down (pinned face up) and the following turn they stand up but only move 1d6 for that round and they cannot attack if they were Engaged. Out of action is the headshot that kills them in either shooting or hand-to-hand.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MusingWarboss