Cawdor/GW4 Speculations/Discussions

[FerociousBeast]

These kits really do need a few empty hands. Looking at the Cawdor polearm guys, you can see that the ones that hold theirs in one hand also have a knife in the other. Assuming polearm stats are decent, I don't think I'd want to dilute my guy's polearm attacks with a knife, not to mention pay for a superfluous piece of wargear, but whatcha gonna do with the other hand? Only alternative is to carve the weapon out of the hand to stay WYSIWYG.

 

[DerekDecker]

Hmmm no? finding empty hand or making clenching fist is simple and pretty easy. Making a house-style weapons however, is not. With the limited budget I'd rather have more special weapons on the plastic than having them shoved into FW resin production. Which is what happen at the moment.

Cawdor might be the only house when converted weapon that look like an ork made it would pass.

Also I noticed that they changed House Cawdor symbol.

 

[Deckard_2049]

I like the new symbol, the symbol they put in the rulebook with the red hood will very likely end up being the redemptionist symbol now.

I also like the artwork with the patchwork mask. Shouldn't be too hard to just paint it like that.

 

[enyoss]

Hmmm no? finding empty hand or making clenching fist is simple and pretty easy. Making a house-style weapons however, is not. With the limited budget I'd rather have more special weapons on the plastic than having them shoved into FW resin production. Which is what happen at the moment.

Cawdor might be the only house when converted weapon that look like an ork made it would pass.

Also I noticed that they changed House Cawdor symbol.

Good spot! I like the new House symbol. The old one was really quite dated in retrospect. Think it was that 5ed WHFB era skull which did it. Nothing bad about it, but was of it’s time more than the rest.

 

[TabulaRasa]

Hmmm no? finding empty hand or making clenching fist is simple and pretty easy. Making a house-style weapons however, is not. With the limited budget I'd rather have more special weapons on the plastic than having them shoved into FW resin production. Which is what happen at the moment.

Cawdor might be the only house when converted weapon that look like an ork made it would pass.

Also I noticed that they changed House Cawdor symbol.

I really like the empty hand parts in the upgrade kit for Goliath. Sure you can always convert one, but it takes time to get it to look good and with the propensity for Goliaths to swing everything, up to and including melta guns, with one hand it's nice with some extra alternatives. One could also argue that what's easier than to create an open/clenched hand is to put a weapon into one that's already is.

 

[DerekDecker]

Yes, keep the open hand to FW resin production. I'll be really angry if i get a bunch of hand in the main kit and next month FW annouce :" Hey kids, Hamster-powered Heavy stubber and rat slinger for Cawdor in FW store soon!".

Actually I was really disappointed when they include a grenade hand in Goliath kit when they badly short on right weapon arms : stub gun, bolt pistol, cleaver,

On the other notes GW profit skyrocket in annual report https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-45019803 So there're a tiny chance that future gang could see some more investment.

 

[Petitioner's City]

I don't think ill be able to watch Thursday to make notes this week ill see!

But given its a week away I guess a long series of notes aren't necessary?

 

[TabulaRasa]

Yes, keep the open hand to FW resin production. I'll be really angry if i get a bunch of hand in the main kit and next month FW annouce :" Hey kids, Hamster-powered Heavy stubber and rat slinger for Cawdor in FW store soon!".

Actually I was really disappointed when they include a grenade hand in Goliath kit when they badly short on right weapon arms : stub gun, bolt pistol, cleaver,

On the other notes GW profit skyrocket in annual report https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-45019803 So there're a tiny chance that future gang could see some more investment.

In regards to the Cawdor set I believe that, depending on the rules, people would be happy if the support hands for the pole weapons would have been empty. The anticipation seems to be that they would work as an 'unwieldy' weapon in cc, and if so you might rather have an empty hand or incendiary charge in that hand. I do believe that no one are vocalising a support for 'empty hands' on the expense of anything like a heavy stubber or similar.

When it comes to Goliath I do agree that it would have been nice with a stub gun more or less, but I've found it fairly easy to convert one by cutting the barrel off of one of the stub cannons (why do you get two of those on the sprue!?). What IMHO would have been a far better solution would have been to skip the horrid rivet cannon completely and give us one empty left hand arm and a right handed brute cleaver. And yes when it comes to Goliath I certainly wouldn't have minded an open hand on the base sprue, given that Grenade Launchers are generally your go to for ranged support, and given how it is a one handed weapon. I for one do not want to waste credits on something that on extremely rare occasions get into close combat.

 

[Deckard_2049]

A couple of resin empty hands is useful, but maybe only one or two. I do hope they have a cobbled together respirator head for Cawdor though, as they are the only gang to not have that option in plastic. I'm kinda annoyed the bionic leg on the cawdor ganger is stuck there without an alternate leg. If I get two boxes then four gangers have the same bionic leg, it's the same issue as the van saar guys stepping up on that block (cawdor also have the leader/champ doing the same).

Thing is if you give the leader the icon, but don't want to give him a flame pistol then there isn't an alternate right arm for that pose that has a different weapon. I hope Cawdor gets 3 full resin sets cause they are going to need it, Orlocks can get by with two cause they are pretty efficient right out of the box. As far as the hand knives go, i'm just going to ignore them or pretend they aren't there as far as wysiwyg goes I focus on the main weapon being used. This stuff can usually be discussed pre game and move on from there.

The painting guide for Cawdor in the WD is pretty worthwhile, if a bit vibrant. Still hoping Duncan makes a guide though..just cause the WD articles and video guides tend to differ a little bit in colors used and technique.

 

[IAmLegion]

I was honestly disappointed that the models for all the gangs only have 2 poses. Does anyone know why they went in this direction beyond the obvious cost savings? Is it because they are launching tons of games constantly? I guess I answered my own question, but my point is that for the hobbyist (I'm at 25 years into the hobby), we want the option to have a bunch of different looking models/poses. And then they tell you that you cant switch weapons around ala put away the clippers. Kind of a shame, but I guess that's just business...

 

[enyoss]

I was honestly disappointed that the models for all the gangs only have 2 poses. Does anyone know why they went in this direction beyond the obvious cost savings? Is it because they are launching tons of games constantly? I guess I answered my own question, but my point is that for the hobbyist (I'm at 25 years into the hobby), we want the option to have a bunch of different looking models/poses. And then they tell you that you cant switch weapons around ala put away the clippers. Kind of a shame, but I guess that's just business...

I’ve found the orlock, at least, are highly customisable on those 5 core bodies. You can get a lot of variation with all the various arms, certainly enough for a gang, and with just a little extra clipping and gluing it’s pretty limitless.

The instructions seem to imply they are much more restrictive than that (eg 2/3 poses per model), but thankfully it just ain’t so.

I’ve heard that the Escher and Goliath are much trickier though thanks to Body/head connections etc.. And it sadly looks like cawdor will be the most restrictive of the bunch with their shoulder vs forearm connections.

 

[Gdolkin]

With the use of all the FW upgrades available and a bit of kit bashing and greenstuffing I've made 45 unique Goliaths and 30 unique Escher, these kits are IMHO not at all as limited or restrictive as some say they are..

 

[maxwellrpower]

@Gdolkin and @enyoss I’m so glad every time I hear this. In my opinion filling a couple of tiny gaps and doing a bit of light snipping and filing is not a very high barrier. Plus the way the Goliath’s shoulder joints are done makes for a way nicer looking join for anyone who wants to just assemble them as they’re shown in the instructions, there’s not really much of a down side. @Thorgor amoung many others has shown that magnetising them isn’t that much of a big deal either.

 

[Still-young]

The Cawdor do look like they'll be the most difficult to make more variable, which is a shame if they're gonna be more 'horde-y' than the others. At least plastic is fairly easy to work with.

 

[spafe]

amoung many others has shown that magnetising them isn’t that much of a big deal either

Yes... @DarkNwss has also magnetised his goliaths and his better half's Escher... hopefully he'll be kind enough to take some pics and document that at some point. They are really quite nicely done, and I think he's done the FW packs too so there is a lot of variety in what he can equip the models with.

 

[spafe]

The Cawdor do look like they'll be the most difficult to make more variable, which is a shame if they're gonna be more 'horde-y' than the others. At least plastic is fairly easy to work with.

They are also more rag tag look though... so the odd rougher edge on cutting them up to convert them shouldn't be an issue. Really compared to the old metal 'hugging rifles into bodies' that they used to have... I'm really looking forward to the fun that wil lbe possible with this kit (and if I like em enough... I'll be expanding my current Cawdor horde up to full guard army status... I expect this will be very very possible).

 

[HorribleHedgehog]

I likewise think that the plastic kits aren't as restrictive as some claim. Sure, two unique frames per kit would've been preferable, and I'm not a fan of fixed pose necks or shoulders (however nice they look!), but overall, the minis are the least of my gripes with N17.

Cawdor do look to be a bit on the samey side, but no worse than the Goliaths IMO. Luckily the dumpster diver aesthetic will be the easiest to convert convincingly.

Actually, the only thing that irks me is that gangers no longer have free knives as standard, which can be a bit of a pain if you want your models to be completely WYSIWYG but don't want to fork out creds for a weapon your ranged support ganger probably won't get much use out of.

 

[spafe]

Yeah, so far the only bugbear I have has been the escher leader coat... That is the only thing I've seen that is restrictive to such a degree as to annoy me... nothing else so far has been

 

[Thorgor]

From the pics we have seen, most of the Cawdor bodies may be as restrictive as the Escher leader coat. It's hard to tell for sure.

The thing with Necromunda plastic kits is that they are already really nice kits, but could have been truly awesome had they gone for two distinct sprues instead of duplicate ones. This would have allowed for 10 different body poses and all the weapon options in one box (which in turn would have meant no 2-months-late FW upgrade sprues, no initially truncated HWL for Escher/Goliath/Orlock, and earlier release dates for all the hired guns, pets, etc.)
I would have happily paid £30 or maybe even £35 for those kits (instead of the current £25).

 

[DerekDecker]

I don't mind duplicate sprue, making a 2 sprue kit would probably took too much time (and effort) for them. What I propose however is an extra sprue/half-sprue of weapon arms that'd require much less effort to make.

FW weapon pack should be more bling/ variations (different pose, ornated weapons, and empty hands so people can make a blood bowl ganger...) than weapons that don't exist in the main kit.