N18 Collected Errors/Typos in N25 Halls of the Ancients (Squats)

TopsyKretts

Hive Lord
Honored Tribesman
Dec 29, 2017
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The 29th book, giving a full republish and update to Squats.


A summary of various findings (contributed by several yaktribe champions).

INTERNAL CONFLICTS
  • Techmite Exovator (p60 & p86): The new one is better in all ways. Orrin's one is copy-pasted from the paper pamphlet that came with the FW resin mini (after being omitted from N23 Aranthian Succession 3 - Ruins of Jardlan).
    • Comment: Why couldn't it be updated according to the new version?
EXTERNAL CONFLICTS (CONFLICT WITH PREVIOUS PUBLICATIONS)
  • Various existing and new items added to gang equipment lists: Inferno pistol (ironhead), grenade launcher (ironhead) with seismic grenades, combat shotgun (ironhead), bolt spitter, axe, two-handed power axe, two-handed power pick, two-handed chainaxe, pets (3 techmite variants).
    • Comment: Seems like an update.
  • Heavy Drill (p114): Completely different profile and cost from existing weapon.
    • Comment: Probably an unmarked "Ironhead" variant.
  • Claim Jumper power maul (p62): Book says power maul but the mini and rules that comes with it clearly says power pick.
    • Comment: Use power pick. Perhaps copy-pasted directly from Ruins of Jardlan without being corrected.
  • Orrin (p88) was originally released as a campaign character for N23 Aranthian Succession part 3 (Ruins of Jardlan), available to Imperial House aligned gangs. New book doesn't seem to mention availability at all?
    • Comment: Presumably he's also available to Squat gangs now.
ERRORS
  • Combat shotgun (ironhead) got profile of normal shotgun (solid) with the normal rapid fire(+1) from ironhead.
    • Comment: So what is it, ironhead shotgun with wrong name or ironhead combat shotgun with wrong profile?
  • Rocks saw is identical to heavy drill, except it has +1S.
    • Comment: In order for heavy drill to be a real option, it needs to be different or cheaper than rock saw.
  • Squat access to power axe and power pick have changed to new two-handed variants instead.
    • Comment: It seems they were never originally intended to have the standard version of these weapons? Weirdly their weapon profiles are still included for reference. Power hammer however remains unchanged.
  • Agents:
    • The fined result (16+) will never trigger because no gang with 10+ Reputation is going to roll for Petition.
    • What happens if it would be possible to be fined for failed petition (2D6*10 credits), but can't pay?
    • Since Agents have a variable cost, what is their contribution to gang rating? Their Equipment rule state the free equipment you get for them should be accounted for when determining Gang Rating, but what is the base value of the House Agent? Generic has a rating of 40 or 80 credits? Special Character has rating of 100 or 200?
NOTES
  • Inferno pistol with ironhead treatment also gains -2" range to short & long in addition to the normal rapid fire (+1). Why? No other ironhead range weapons got this treatment.
  • Ironhead grenade launcher isn't really ironhead at all, since it doesn't have rapid fire. All it has is Seismic ammo, which is new, but not particularly ironheady. Only real distinction is that this weapon probably can't take other normal ammo types.
  • Techmites are the first pets to have weapon options.
  • Ancestry post-battle actions may be purchased with XP as Primary skills. Does this mean random? Doesn't seem to be specified. It would be a very good random purchase since there are only 3 available per clan, and eligible fighters already start with one, so it's 50% chance of getting it at a good discount.

CHANGES AND IMPROVEMENTS
  • Power pack (p123): Both melee and sidearm can be used in close combat.
    • Comment: A late but welcoming update.
  • Squat power fist finally given the unique name "Ironhead power fist".
    • Comment: A great update, what took them so long?
  • Techmites (pets): Available to Squat Leader & Champs (not just hangers-on and special characters), and as a consequence got cost and skill sets. Also updated in various ways.
    • Autoveyor: Access to Power Pack weapon options.
    • Exovator: +1T, Tech Bypass, Nobody Pushes Kin Around, traded Flak for Mesh, can buy 2 Power Pack weapons.
  • Gearhead (crew): Removed Bio-booster in equipment list :D
 
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Not an error, but a fix to the ‘Power Pack’ trait to include power pack weapons with either MELEE or SIDEARM trait (previously RAW only those with MELEE trait).

“… If the weapon also has the Melee or Sidearm trait, it can be used in addition to any other weapon carried by the fighter, granting an additional close combat attack.”
HALL OF THE ANCIENTS, p123

“… If the weapon also has the Melee trait it can be used in addition to any other weapon carried by the fight granting an additional close combat attack.”
BOOK OF THE OUTLANDS, p142

Post in thread 'Squat ‘Stoneburner’ in close combat (Power Pack andSidearm traits)'
https://yaktribe.games/community/th...ower-pack-andsidearm-traits.12846/post-327097
 
Seems like Leader & Champ got inferno pistol & nade launcher now? Didn't have that before. Among many other new options.
 
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How do you reckon the changes to techmite pets affect the originals?
  • Claim Jumper (Hangers-on) with Autoveyor: Probably no change.
  • Orrin with Exovator: This new version is much better, yet Orrin got one with a unique Fusion Cutter weapon.
  • Urson with Oculi: Identical.
I think for Orrin's Exovator, it makes sense to use a mix profile from v2 and adding weapons from v1. It feels copy-pastey to use the old one again.
 
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  • Combat shotgun (ironhead) got profile of normal shotgun (solid) with the normal rapid fire(+1) from ironhead.
    • Comment: So what is it, ironhead shotgun with wrong name or ironhead combat shotgun with wrong profile?
I think the world would not have cracked if they just said Ironhead Shotgun.
They could have saved 6 letters print ink. Over all the books they print it would have added up.
  • Rocks saw is identical to heavy drill, except it has +1S.
    • Comment: In order for heavy drill to be a real option, it needs to be different or cheaper than rock saw.
Looks like a copy and paste table screw up. It's not like they already had a two handed drill and saw to scale down. Oh wait..
  • Inferno pistol with ironhead treatment also gains -2" range to short & long in addition to the normal rapid fire (+1). Why? No other ironhead range weapons got this treatment.
I suppose this actually makes a bit of sense to me. A rapid fire melts pistol at standard range is extremely powerful especially with Sidearm and melta. Dropping the range a bit makes is a slightly less super weapon.
The other weapons basically have double barrels and extra giant magazines. Can't really see that on a pistol sizes mini fusion reactor beam thing.
  • Ironhead grenade launcher isn't really ironhead at all, since it doesn't have rapid fire. All it has is Seismic ammo, which is new, but not particularly ironheady. Only real distinction is that this weapon probably can't take other normal ammo types.
RAW it can't take extra ammo types.
Seismic seams to me to be quite Ironheady. They seam to be crushy tools for smashing rocks which is very Prospector. I think the Charter/Drill masters and the Excavator should have access to both this Seismic grenade launcher and the Seismic Cannon as standard. It fits in the mining tool idea very
  • Power pack (p123): Both melee and sidearm can be used in close combat.
    • Comment: A late but welcoming update.
Thank Emperor for that.
  • Squat power fist finally given the unique name "Ironhead power fist".
    • Comment: A great update, what took them so long?
Administratum reasons?...
I suppose they thought of a big power glove for the Ironheads but then remembered after printing (in typical GW fashion) that the Power Fist is a Iconic Space marine/Imperial 40K image so they can't really just stick a dwarf plaster over it and hope nobody notices.

Do you think the Heavy Melta ammo value of 4+ is right? It seams like a over charged Ironhead melta gun (Ammo 5+) rather than a stripped down Multimelta.
Pumping more energy into the weapon to boost it's range should not make the ammo situation easier at most it would only maintain the ammo issue.
 
About the meltapistol. Ok so the range effectively melted a bit due to being so powerful. From my perspective, that's already the case for melta weapons (and most other weapons too). Multi-melta got longest range. Meltagun got medium. Pistol got short. Ironhead's rapid fire makes pistol shorter, but not meltagun? Ok fine, whatever. Too much spent over 2" haha. For seismic, yeah I get that it is miney, but ironheady? Virtually all Ironhead weapons gain Rapid Fire (+1). What would seismic grenades look like without Ironhead? Not seismic? There are no pre-existing seismic grenades in the game. I'm a bit of a free spirit so I'm calling it seismic (without the ironhead part) :p

Was surprised this book went down a notch in quality, after the surprisingly good N23 rulebook. And generally all books that followed.

Orrin's Techmite Exovator pet is reprinted here, identical to the previous version, but unlike the new Exovator. Feels like an oversight to let the special character have a weaker, simpler variant (albeit with a stronger, unique gun).
 
About the meltapistol. Ok so the range effectively melted a bit due to being so powerful. From my perspective, that's already the case for melta weapons (and most other weapons too). Multi-melta got longest range. Meltagun got medium. Pistol got short. Ironhead's rapid fire makes pistol shorter, but not meltagun? Ok fine, whatever. Too much spent over 2" haha.
I assume they will change it in a faq with very little announcement.
For seismic, yeah I get that it is miney, but ironheady? Virtually all Ironhead weapons gain Rapid Fire (+1). What would seismic grenades look like without Ironhead? Not seismic? There are no pre-existing seismic grenades in the game. I'm a bit of a free spirit so I'm calling it seismic (without the ironhead part) :p
Ah but the squats are described as miners, prospectors and workers first and for most. They are not going out to shoot anything that moves to death. They go around with tools. Meltas for melting rock and metal, all the hammers and axes to chop and smash scrap, flamers to burn of toxic sludge etc.
Ok they put up with no attitude and it hurts being on the wrong end of them.
I'm sure you could use bolters explosive rounds for demolitions or something.

Hmm Seismic grenades? Maybe if we continue mentioning them GW will oblige?
Orrin's Techmite Exovator pet is reprinted here, identical to the previous version, but unlike the new Exovator. Feels like an oversight to let the special character have a weaker, simpler variant (albeit with a stronger, unique gun).
Orrin and his pet robot are a Dramatic persona and as such they sometimes have custom equipment that differs from the normal version. GW have done it before and confirmed they were doing it in the FAQ.
They could have just re named the new one. It's not like they were making up new tech names at the same time or anything...
Of course it could very well be a copout on there part so they don't admit they messed up or have to re print the thing.
 
Claim Jumper power maul (p62): Book says power maul but the mini and rules that comes with it clearly says power pick.
  • Comment: Use power pick. Perhaps copy-pasted directly from Ruins of Jardlan without being corrected.

True, but he is holding a power pick while now every Picks" is two handed. So only him has access to one handed powe pick? I havent found the power pick in the book Ruins of Jardlan but it is in hall of the ancients p 114.

On a side note. Unless you have a suspensor harness to compensate that the double handed power pick will take two slots, you will be limited. It may be better to wait to go to the trading post to buy a power pick.
 
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Now, Urson's 'Release the Oculi!' rule? I've not got the book to hand, but when I read it the other day, I thought: "Can he not add one if there's somebody else's Oculi on the table? Like a Svenotar' or Champions'?"

The wording of his rule seemed to sound - RAW - like it only lets you go from 0 - > 1. Like it doesn't only apply to his Oculi?
 
Techmites' weapon prices
We know there's the price weirdness I the Bolt Spitter, but given that it's their only weapon option (so not offering much in the way of fancy bonuses like an Unwieldy-wielding Squat might gain)...

Is it likely that the Bolt Spitter weirdness indicates they were about to have different prices, but that that never got to completion?

I.e. maybe they weren't going to be +100cr for an Arc Welder attack?

I know the Arc Welder & Stone Cutter are good in their own right, but especially the gem cutter compared to a power hammer, it's somewhat baffling - to me - to think that their credit values are right.

Doesn't it mean that almost all of the ones that make it to the table will be onr-or-two-drills or maybe a drill & bolt spitters, at best? Or lone bolt spitters.

Heck, just bare weaponless autoveyors offer best bang for buck of the two weaponies, don't they? You want to be getting them near loot casket for a sweet d6×10cr on top of whatever else is in the box?

Even then, as extra guns they're surely in competition with Drill-Kyn and Diggers, aren't they? Like 100cr can get you a very cheery pair of Diggers & IH Stub-Guns w/DD, or a Drillkyn with IH autogun & 25cr of whatever else...

If it weren't for the 45cr bolt spitter, I'd have chalked the whole thing up as being "just very expensive, maybe not thought through?", but the odd discrepancy has me thinking: "were they meaning to change the prices? Did they forget? Send the wrong version? Run out of time? Copy + paste snafu? Something else?"

Annoyingly, it's hard to speculate, but easy to wish.

(The oddity of the Exo-kyn weapons being... a bit lacklustre, except the hammer, has me thinking in the a similar direction.)
 
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We will never know haha. Based on experience, all those guesses could be true (at the same time). D6x10 creds for loot? It's a sweet D6 credits mind you :LOL: Don't think you can compare power hammer and power pack weapons because power pack is only 1A, unaffected by attack stat.
 
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Phantom kit sighted on page 119:

Proximity Auspex (Exclusive) - no cost, no reference to in equipment listings for any of the Squat fighters.
The kit itself is an activated-by-Basic-action variant of Augerspex (from the Book of Desolation/Hive Secundus lists) that Reveals a hidden target within 24" rather than preventing Infiltration/deployment - that is significantly better than 35 credit photogoggles by any stretch of the imagination (and the ‘umble 20 credit Flare). Imagine being able to Proximity Auspex then target an Ironhead Heavy Bolter at an enemy 24” away during a visibility 3” encounter, then your buddies can shoot at them too…and you won’t be revealed by the Basic action of the Auspex…

I checked Desolation and Secundus, Proximity Auspex seems to first appear in HotAn*.

There are 10 mentions of Auspex in the book, 8 of them in the Auspex-Ghost scenario, the rest in this equipment entry.
The tech mites and the target painting variant (oculi) might have been the original intended possessor of this equipment, or it may have been meant for one of the exo-kyn for target-painting someone too far away to charge?

Bloody cool piece of kit for Ash Wastes games - wish there was an errata telling us who can take it, and how...

On the other hand, it would probably be appropriate for Ash Waste Nomads…


Edit: Nevermind, found it on Urson Grimjarl, Bounty Hunter - page 101. Seems to be an intended ability stemming from having a Oculi Techmite like he has, but might have been deemed too powerful for universal inclusion.

At 160 credits Urson seems to be incredible value candidate for an Outcast elevated leader…

The text for the equipment listing didn’t get picked up by my Ctrl-F searches.
 
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Fighter cards are images unfortunately. It can be a potential guide to search in my Necrodamus pdf. It is a bit unusual to have character abilities represented as equipment and included in equipment summary. But it looks pretty much identical to how it was first published in Ruins of Jardlan (Aranthian Succession 3).
 
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We will never know haha. Based on experience, all those guesses could be true (at the same time). D6x10 creds for loot? It's a sweet D6 credits mind you :LOL: Don't think you can compare power hammer and power pack weapons because power pack is only 1A, unaffected by attack stat.
Fair point; all and none, all at once, no doubt!

With the D6×10, I make that in reference to the There's always another secret skill of the Autoveyors. So if anything, it's more like D6×11!

Similarly, the PH/pack: on techmites, they're ostensibly only getting at most 2 attacks with any weapon... So what happens when a techmite has only one weapon, but charges? Do they still get their native unarmed attack, as well as a +1PP?

(Prior to HotA, I'd interpreted the rule to be "it's a weapon", generally, and the +1 attack business is for 'counting as a second weapon, but you can get +1+1 if you've two. But if memory serves that's not easily defended as an interpretation. And with the new wording, I felt even less confident.)
 
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