N18 Compendium YAQ (N18)

TopsyKretts

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1. In N17 (presumably N18 too), you can move through friendly fighters. So can a fighter move through friendly fighters when it's knocked back, to avoid the D+1 penalty? (Assuming it can end its move without overlapping.)
No, the reason is when a fighter moves (voluntarily), it can decide not to crash into friendly fighters when moving past them. When the fighter is knocked into a friendly fighter, this is involuntarily, so the fighter can't decide not to crash into friendly fighters. This is specifically handled in other miniature games (voluntary vs involuntary) where this distinction is RAW. In N18, we're not spoiled with clear rules that specify this. For example a fighter with a skill that allows for ignoring difficult terrain (moving full speed) would still be knocked back half speed in difficult terrain.
 

Vonvilkee

Gang Hero
Jan 7, 2018
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Back to the missing ones always miss shooting... I think in my house rules I'm gonna use an inverse of the 7+ to hit as pistols with telescopic sights get auto hits quite easily (not good) but should hit better than ones always missing!

Example fighter needs a 1+ to hit if a one is rolled roll again hitting on a 6, hitting on a 0+? If you roll a one roll again hitting on a 5+ etc comments?
 

TopsyKretts

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I think always fail on 1 is a great universal rule for all GW games. Wouldn't touch it. Keep the game less deadly, fighters in the underhive shouldn't hit on 2+ anyways.

But you have some nice symmetry going!
 

Vonvilkee

Gang Hero
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I agree ones always missing is nice to see but this is the under hive given that the rules no longer state that I'm thinking this will be a nice thing to implement that shows I'm not just punitively impacting bs and it actually makes the skills useful instead of just pushing the bs as low as possible...
 

TopsyKretts

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Yeah I see your arguments, but I'm hellbent on punitively impacting bs and ranged attacks :p I would also count it as an obvious mistake/oversight that it's not specified.
 

Thorgor

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Just to let you know I did start working on the N18 YAQ document.
However, my hobby time is severely limited at the moment, and what little is left of it is spent painting stuff to meet the FYSC deadlines.
If you want to take a look at the WiP, it's here. I'd say it's about 10% finished (not all TODOs are in the file yet...)
I may have more time to work on it this week and the next since I'm away from home due to work (that is, if I'm not also exhausted due to work and all that travelling).
 

crazedloon

Juve
Aug 21, 2018
13
19
3
Earth
Not sure if this has been discussed, sorry if it has, but do blast weapons bypass the normal target priority rules?

Relevant rules:

TARGET PRIORITY: A fighter must target the closest eligible target when making a ranged attack... (description of what qualifies a enemy fighter as an eligible target) .... Otherwise, to attack an eligible target that is not the closest, the attacker must first pass a Cool check.

BLAST MARKERS: If attacking with any weapon with the Blast (X) trait a fighter may target a point on the tabletop instead of an eligible enemy fighter, using a blast marker.

Discussion:
Blast markers reference replacing shooting eligible enemy fighters which is not the same thing as an eligible targets. So this begs the following questions

Does this mean the blast rules are used to describe another form of eligible target (much like the priority rules describe how a fighter can be an eligible target)?

If blast defines another definition of eligible target, then how does a blast weapon shoot?

-Do you need to always pass a cool check since an eligible target, the ground immediately in front of the fighter being the closest eligible target.

-Or do you consider the closest fighter as the closest fighter and if you pass a check you can target other things (including the ground)
 

Stoof

Yakmarines 2nd Co. Word Priest
Yak Comp 2nd Place
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Blast weapons disregard the normal target priority rules, they have no requirement to be fired at the closest available target. I know some people house-rule it that the blast must be placed to hit the closest enemy before any scattering, but that's all it is - a house rule. I don't think this has changed between N17 & N18 but my books are at home.
 

Thorgor

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Yeah, it has been discussed before (not sure if it was in this thread or another).
I think the consensus was that, RAI, you should center the Blast marker on the closest visible enemy fighter unless you first pass a Cool check (in which case you are free to target any fighter or any point on the tabletop). As you noticed, a strict RAW reading means the fighter has to pass a Cool check not to target their own feet, which is obviously not intended)

@Stoof: with the N18 rewrite Blast weapons now target stuff, so it's harder to justify them disregarding the target priority rules (especially as the change looks like an obvious rule patch to prevent this particular reading.)
 
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Thorgor

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Ok guys. I'm almost done going through my notes, which means I've added mostly questions about the core rules, campaign rules and territories as I've only taken notes for the Rulebook, scenarios excluded (there are still a lot of incoming questions about Skills, Traits, Tactics cards, etc. about half of which should concern Versatile :LOL:)

So, I still have a lot of work to do, but I think it's time we start working on the answers together. I've already added answers for most questions (the less controversial ones imo, but feel free to discuss them if you disagree), but I'd like to get consensus on the rest. Namely:

2.02 When a fighter is Seriously injured in Close combat and then immediately taken Out of action with the free Coup de grâce action, how many Nerve tests should nearby friendly fighters take?

2.05 If a Psyker triggers the Whispers from the Warp peril while casting a Simple or Basic Psychic power as their first action, can they make a second Simple/Basic action as normal or should they immediately roll for Insanity?

5.06 How do combi weapons (and other weapons with multiple profiles) interact with weapon accessories? Do they apply to both parts of the weapon? Can you fit a Lasgun / Plasma gun with an Infrasight (the Lasgun part doesn't have Rapid fire but the Plasma gun part does)? Can you fit a Polearm/autogun with a Las-projector (it's a Basic weapon) and, if you do, does the Polearm profile get +1 to hit at short range?

6.02 If a Juve takes, for instance, two BS advancements before being promoted to Champion status (paying 6XP for each), how much does the third BS advancement then cost? Do you jump from a 0 XP tax straight to a 4 XP tax?

6.03 A fighter gains Experience "if their action directly causes an enemy fighter to go Out of Action". What does it mean exactly? For instance, if a fighter falls on an enemy fighter and they both go Out of Action as a result, does any of those fighters get XP? If a fighter uses a weapon with Knockback to have an enemy fighter fall on another enemy fighter and they both go Out of Action as a result, does this fighter get XP for both enemy fighters? If a fighter Seriously injures an enemy fighter and they go Out of Action during the Recovery phase of the same turn, does this fighter get XP?

6.04 What can the 250 credits you get during downtime be spent on exactly? The rules state you can use them to recruit "new fighters and/or Hangers-on", but can you also get equipment for those new fighters? And if you can get equipment for them, are you limited to the gang's House Equipment List (like at gang creation), or can you also get equipment from the Trading Post? And if you can get equipment from the Trading Post, can you roll for rare items as if you were visiting the Trading post during the post-battle sequence?

6.05 How are challenges managed exactly? Is there really no rule governing who can issue a challenge or how many challenges can be issued/accepted?

6.08 The rules for capturing fighters state that capturing fighters can only happen "if only one gang has fighters on the battlefield at the end of the battle". However, they also state that fighters "who have succumbed to their injuries during the Wrap-up" are eligible for capture. Does it mean that Seriously injured fighters do not count when determining whether a gang has fighters on the battlefield at the end of the battle? Or does it depend on whether those fighters recover or go Out of action during the Wrap-up?
Similarly, Web states that fighters who are Webbed at the end of the battle (and automatically recover) can be captured and even add +1 to the Capture roll. How does it all work?

6.10 The rules state that you need to have "at least one fighter on the battlefield at the end of the battle" to retrieve equipment from dead fighters. Do Seriously Injured fighters count (and does it depend on whether or not they succumb to their injuries)?

7.02 How exactly do territories that grant some of your fighters grenades work? Do you get additional grenades after each battle or only once? Can you change which fighters they are equipped to? If you only get grenades once and one of the equipped fighters die, is the grenade lost forever? Can you sell those grenades? Can you give them to another gang in exchange of a captured fighter?

7.03 Corpse Farm state that the gang gains credits for "every fighter on either side that was deleted from their roster during the Update Roster step of the preceding battle". Does that mean retiring fighters are also sent to the farm?

7.04 Should the marker that non-Delaque fighters get for using the Drinking Hole special boon be treated as a "drunk" condition, or are they cumulative? (if a fighter rerolls two Cool checks during the game, do they get a -2 to hit penalty?) Is there any limit on the number of Cool checks each fighter can reroll this way during the game?

7.05 If a player controls a Mine Workings territory, can they send Captive working the mine before their owner had a chance to attempt a Rescue mission?

7.06 What happens if an Orlock player controls a Toll Crossing territory and two players in the same battle both pay them 20 credits?
Can the Orlock player refuse a payment if they don't want a gang to benefit from this boon?

7.07 How does the Archeotech device work exactly? Are the chosen traits and the affected weapons locked once and for all, or can you change everything during each post-battle sequence?

7.08 Can the Archeotech Device be used to give traits to close combat weapons? If so, what does Unstable do on a close combat weapon?

10.02 How does the Blast marker translate in Sector Mechanicus games?

10.03 How does the Flame template translate in Sector Mechanicus games?
The link to my WIP document is in my signature (and @Stoof should be able to edit it)
I'll continue adding questions, from this thread and others in the sub-forum. I think it's very possible the number of questions will reach triple digits before I'm done...
 
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Mar 1, 2018
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We had no idea how to deal with pinned civilians in the dust town dust up. Didn't seem to be any rules for unpinning, or how being pinned effected thier actions.
 

Thorgor

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We had no idea how to deal with pinned civilians in the dust town dust up. Didn't seem to be any rules for unpinning, or how being pinned effected thier actions.
Indeed, there are no rule. You also have to assume how they act when engaged or broken (presumably, they respectively make a Fight action or Run for cover instead of their normal random action)
I'd suggest having them Stand up during the End phase (instead of moving) and replacing the 1-2 result with a Blind fire action.
 
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TopsyKretts

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Great list of points! I agree these are not described properly in the rules. Are we encouraged to discuss these now or wait? I'm eager to share some thoughts, please ignore if its too soon.

2.02 When a fighter is Seriously injured in Close combat and then immediately taken Out of action with the free Coup de grâce action, how many Nerve tests should nearby friendly fighters take?

I would expect a single Nerve test.


6.02 If a Juve takes, for instance, two BS advancements before being promoted to Champion status (paying 6XP for each), how much does the third BS advancement then cost? Do you jump from a 0 XP tax straight to a 4 XP tax?


I would expect when promoted to Champion, compare to fresh Champion base characterstic.

6.03 A fighter gains Experience "if their action directly causes an enemy fighter to go Out of Action". What does it mean exactly? ... If a fighter Seriously injures an enemy fighter and they go Out of Action during the Recovery phase of the same turn, does this fighter get XP?


We (mainly) played that the target must go OoA in the attacker's activation (with exception for reaction attacks or out of activation attacks from cards etc.). This would mean XP award if a target is pinned, falls and goes OoA as a result of the fall. But no XP if the fighter goes OoA later, for example Recovery as used as example here.

7.03 Corpse Farm state that the gang gains credits for "every fighter on either side that was deleted from their roster during the Update Roster step of the preceding battle". Does that mean retiring fighters are also sent to the farm?


The intention seems to be that the fighters should die either directly or if not taken to doc.

7.04 Should the marker that non-Delaque fighters get for using the Drinking Hole special boon be treated as a "drunk" condition, or are they cumulative? (if a fighter rerolls two Cool checks during the game, do they get a -2 to hit penalty?) Is there any limit on the number of Cool checks each fighter can reroll this way during the game?


I think it would be most fun if it was cumulative. Maybe go OoA if used so much the fighter hits on 7+?
 

TopsyKretts

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I'm very much interested in all such problems for a complete YAQ / house-rule list. Unfortunately I've lost track of all potential problems after N18 was released.
 

Thorgor

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To answer your thoughs (that I mostly share):

2.02 When a fighter is Seriously injured in Close combat and then immediately taken Out of action with the free Coup de grâce action, how many Nerve tests should nearby friendly fighters take?

I would expect a single Nerve test.
I agree. I think this one may be a bit controversial since the RAW are quite clear you need to test twice. But since both events are practically simultaneous, I think a single test would be more appropriate (and I'm pretty sure that's how most players instinctively play it) so I'm willing to rule it as an oversight.

6.02 If a Juve takes, for instance, two BS advancements before being promoted to Champion status (paying 6XP for each), how much does the third BS advancement then cost? Do you jump from a 0 XP tax straight to a 4 XP tax?

I would expect when promoted to Champion, compare to fresh Champion base characterstic.
That's an alternative I didn't think of! This may not be RAW but I like it as it means you don't have to track every single advancement separately and can simply compare the current profile to its base one.

6.03 A fighter gains Experience "if their action directly causes an enemy fighter to go Out of Action". What does it mean exactly? ... If a fighter Seriously injures an enemy fighter and they go Out of Action during the Recovery phase of the same turn, does this fighter get XP?

We (mainly) played that the target must go OoA in the attacker's activation (with exception for reaction attacks or out of activation attacks from cards etc.). This would mean XP award if a target is pinned, falls and goes OoA as a result of the fall. But no XP if the fighter goes OoA later, for example Recovery as used as example here.
Yeah, that's also mostly how I understand it. What about the (admittedly unlikely) scenario where you kill a fighter by having another fighter fall on them/tossing another fighter at them? Would you score XP for both fighters?

7.03 Corpse Farm state that the gang gains credits for "every fighter on either side that was deleted from their roster during the Update Roster step of the preceding battle". Does that mean retiring fighters are also sent to the farm?

The intention seems to be that the fighters should die either directly or if not taken to doc.
I agree, I think they simply messed up the terminology here. I mostly brought it up because I find the thought of retiring fighters being 'sent to the farm' absolutely hilarious (and something Scavvies would definitely do)

7.04 Should the marker that non-Delaque fighters get for using the Drinking Hole special boon be treated as a "drunk" condition, or are they cumulative? (if a fighter rerolls two Cool checks during the game, do they get a -2 to hit penalty?) Is there any limit on the number of Cool checks each fighter can reroll this way during the game?

I think it would be most fun if it was cumulative. Maybe go OoA if used so much the fighter hits on 7+?
I would totally support that last bit as an house-rule, but I'm not completely confident with erring that far of the RAW in the YAQ. I agree that having the marker be cumulative is probably intentional though (and it creates some natural soft cap for using the boon in battle).
 
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nooobody

Juve
Sep 11, 2018
12
7
3
earth
2.02 When a fighter is Seriously injured in Close combat and then immediately taken Out of action with the free Coup de grâce action, how many Nerve tests should nearby friendly fighters take?
I would say two, because they are the result of fight action and coup de grace action, respectively. We don't roll for coup de grace doesn't mean it takes less time than any other action.
Imagine you have a super awesome range weapon, when a fighter is seriously injured by its shot, you can immediately make another free shoot action at the same target and the target is automatically go OOA. How many Nerve tests should nearby friendly fighters take?

5.06 How do combi weapons (and other weapons with multiple profiles) interact with weapon accessories? Do they apply to both parts of the weapon? Can you fit a Lasgun / Plasma gun with an Infrasight (the Lasgun part doesn't have Rapid fire but the Plasma gun part does)? Can you fit a Polearm/autogun with a Las-projector (it's a Basic weapon) and, if you do, does the Polearm profile get +1 to hit at short range?
For combi weapons, only the lasgun part can benefit from the infra sight? As rapid-fire and infra sight is not compatible.
For the polearm/autogun, only the autogun should get +1 to hit at short range. The whole range of "weapon accessories" are gun accessories.

6.03 A fighter gains Experience "if their action directly causes an enemy fighter to go Out of Action". What does it mean exactly? For instance, if a fighter falls on an enemy fighter and they both go Out of Action as a result, does any of those fighters get XP?
If Alice takes a leap or jump down action and falls on Bob and they both go OOA, Alice should be the one who get XP. Bob gets nothing because he takes no action.

If a fighter uses a weapon with Knockback to have an enemy fighter fall on another enemy fighter and they both go Out of Action as a result, does this fighter get XP for both enemy fighters?
Yes.

If a fighter Seriously injures an enemy fighter and they go Out of Action during the Recovery phase of the same turn, does this fighter get XP?
I wouldn't call it "directly"... If Alice acts first and seriously injures Bob, and 20+ fighters from both sides take turns to take their actions before the end phase, we don't even remember who took Bob down.

6.10 The rules state that you need to have "at least one fighter on the battlefield at the end of the battle" to retrieve equipment from dead fighters. Do Seriously Injured fighters count (and does it depend on whether or not they succumb to their injuries)?
Yes. A seriously injured fighter is "a fighter" after all.
Unless otherwise stated, a fighter who is webbed / insane / on fire / blind / trapped / locked in a room / get drunk / lost all limbs / busy making love... no matter how unlikely he can retrieve the equipments, is still a fighter.

7.03 Corpse Farm state that the gang gains credits for "every fighter on either side that was deleted from their roster during the Update Roster step of the preceding battle". Does that mean retiring fighters are also sent to the farm?
This kind of "retire" sounds cool. :p
 

Thorgor

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I would say two, because they are the result of fight action and coup de grace action, respectively. We don't roll for coup de grace doesn't mean it takes less time than any other action.
Imagine you have a super awesome range weapon, when a fighter is seriously injured by its shot, you can immediately make another free shoot action at the same target and the target is automatically go OOA. How many Nerve tests should nearby friendly fighters take?
Yeah, RAW it's two. But it's kinda strange that seeing your friend being disemboweled in close combat is less terrifying than seeing them being gutshot at point blank and then having there throat slashed. Also, it means that rolling a Serious injury can actually be worse than rolling an Out of action result, which is a bit counter-intuitive.

For combi weapons, only the lasgun part can benefit from the infra sight? As rapid-fire and infra sight is not compatible.
For the polearm/autogun, only the autogun should get +1 to hit at short range. The whole range of "weapon accessories" are gun accessories.
Seems logical, but what would be the rule? You can fit a multi-profile weapon with an accessory if at least one of its sub-weapon can be fitted with it, but only the sub-weapon that can be fitted with it benefit from it? If a polearm/blunderbuss (a combo of Basic and CC weapons that is classified as Basic) can have a sight but the polearm doesn't benefit from it, then it's kinda strange that, say, a lasgun/plasma gun (a combo of Basic and Special weapons that is classified as Special) cannot be fitted with a gunshroud (that would apply only to the lasgun) or even a hotshot las pack.
Also, sights should logically apply to the whole thing, but gunshrouds? Leaving aside that gunshrouds should not be compatible with plasma pistols to begin with, it's strange for a single gunshroud to be able to silence both parts of a combi stub gun/plasma pistol (unless it's some kind of high-tech thingy that nullifies sound, and not a conventional silencer).

If Alice takes a leap or jump down action and falls on Bob and they both go OOA, Alice should be the one who get XP. Bob gets nothing because he takes no action.
Yes, Bob takes no action. However, it's also the case when a fighter takes an enemy OoA with a reaction attack. Shouldn't that fighter get XP?
And, about Alice, all she did was slip and fall to her death. Is it really something that should be rewarded with XP? I mean, technically she made an action, and that action resulted in Bob's death, but is she directly responsible? Is it that different from Alice being thrown at Bob by Charlie (assume 3 different gangs), a scenario where Charlie should apparently get all the XP? Shouldn't gravity get the XP then? :LOL:

Yes. A seriously injured fighter is "a fighter" after all.
Unless otherwise stated, a fighter who is webbed / insane / on fire / blind / trapped / locked in a room / get drunk / lost all limbs / busy making love... no matter how unlikely he can retrieve the equipments, is still a fighter.
The problem with that logic is that, if you consider Seriously injured/Webbed fighters as 'fighters', the rules for Capturing fighters make no sense.
Also, a Seriously injured fighter who succumbs to their injury during the Wrap up should not be able to retrieve their own equipment.