N18 Delaque Gang Options

Banjulhu

Juve
Oct 7, 2019
44
34
18
So Delaque is here and their game style has been changed massively because Savant does not replace Shooting in a good way.

But they do have the option to take Psykers for extra credits and whilst I'm not yet sold on them myself there is at least gimmicks that look like they could work.

The thing that is bugging me is that whilst I love the look of new kit I'm not sure what of it I would want to take in a gang. That said I'm no longer sure what I want to take from the base gang either.

On the gang leader front we're probably looking at either a web gauntlet assassin or the likely more useful (but also boring) Overseer that eventually picks up a few support Savant abilities because xp will have to be spent.

The champions are odd now. Phantoms get a wide range of guns but no way to really enhance them thanks to no longer having reliable access to Fast Shot. They do get primary Obfuscation which means you could build a reliable psyker but without access to the wyrm leveraging them may be tricky. The infiltrating web gun champ will always be useful.

Natch-Ghuls I'm just not sure about. The sword is far too expensive for what it does but the claws can pack a punch but much like the Phantom and guns the Nacht-Ghul's primary skills don't help it much once you have Dodge and Evade (also possibly Spring Up). There does feel like there is room for a Infiltrating Phantom with Web gun supporting a claw wielding Nacht-Ghul but that is a lot of eggs in one basket.

Gangers and basic Juves are still easy to work out as its all about having autoguns, pistols and smoke grenades for days.

The Psy-Gheist's may have potential. I like the harness but having to stick it on an unreliable juve chassis is not the path to take with such an expensive bit of wargear, it could however be a later purchase once the juve has some advances. Psy-Gheists with just a pistol and a wyrm does seem like an interesting route to go as you can hang them back but still have them effect the board and they can eventually become Phantoms to get better guns and Primary Obfuscation so that they can be extremely reliable psykers. I do kind of want to try some Group activation Penumbral Mirror shenanigans.

The new brute looks fun as something an opponent wont be able to ignore that can also be used in a pinch to do scenario based stuff thanks to flight but it may be a bit too expensive to go in a starting gang.
 

Banjulhu

Juve
Oct 7, 2019
44
34
18
So this is where I have got to after playing around. I might drop the wyrm on the Juve in favour of a 2nd Juve with stub pistol for the extra slightly more reliable body but I like the spread of weapon ranges even if most are a bit basic.

The core plan for most missions is to set the two champs up in scary places to start killing things whilst the leader drags his people after him and keeps telling the Ganger with the long rifle to fire through smoke dropped by the mooks. The Juve will be there to not die and collect xp for a few games.
IDNameCharacteristicsWargear, Skills & InjuriesXP
Leader
Master of Shadow
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
53333232665612000No


W:❑❑ FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Stub Gun, Mesh Armor,
Skills: Overseer
Rules: Gang Hierarchy (Leader), Gang Leader, Group Activation (2), Psychoteric Whispers, Tools of the Trade
Champ1
Nacht-Ghul
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
62343222766721500No


W:❑❑ FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Mesh Armor, Serpent's Fangs*,
Skills: Dodge
Rules: From the Shadows, Gang Hierarchy (Champion), Group Activation (1), Psychoteric Whispers, Tools of the Trade
Champ2
Phantom
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
53333242766621500No


W:❑❑ FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Mesh Armor, Web Gun,
Skills: Infiltrate
Rules: Gang Hierarchy (Champion), Group Activation (1), Psychoteric Whispers, Tools of the Trade
Ganger1
Ghost Specialist
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
5443314176777000No


FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Photo-goggles, Long Rifle,
Rules: Gang Fighter (Ganger), Tools of the Trade
Ganger2
Ghost
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
5443314176777000No


FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Autogun, Smoke Grenade,
Rules: Gang Fighter (Ganger), Promotion (Specialist)
Juve1
Psy-Gheist
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
64533131978813500No


FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Stub Gun, Psychoteric Worm,
Skills: Penumbral Mirror
Rules: Fast Learner, Gang Fighter (Prospect), Hot-headed, Non-sanctioned Psyker, Promotion (Champion), Psychoteric Mastery, Tools of the Trade
Ganger3
Ghost
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
5443314176778500No


FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Shotgun - Solid/Scatter, Smoke Grenade,
Rules: Gang Fighter (Ganger), Promotion (Specialist)
Ganger4
Ghost
Kills ❑❑❑❑❑

MWSBSSTWIALdClWilIntCostAdvXPStarving
5443314176775500No


FW: ❑❑❑ OOA:❑Rec:❑
Wargear: Autogun, Smoke Grenade,
Rules: Gang Fighter (Ganger), Promotion (Specialist)
 
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almic85

Cranky Git
Oct 30, 2014
2,365
4,253
163
Palmerston, ACT, Australia
Looks like a solid list, though I am not sure exactly what the Overseer leader is going to be doing in it.

Because your list doesn’t have any heavy weapons and your two champions are likely to be placed too far up the board to benefit from Overseer, who exactly are you planning to give a second action to?

Same question on the smoke grenades on all hour gangers. Who exactly are you trying to protect with the smoke given that your two champions will be too far up the board to benefit from it and your leader may as well be hiding as he can’t do any damage.

I would be dropping all the smoke (and the photogoggles) from the starting list in exchange for a good special weapon (like a plasmagun) for the leader.

After your first few games when you have credits you can start to build up on smoke, photogoggles and infrasights (and armour).

edit: just noticed my phone had autocorrected overseer to Overwatch.
 
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Banjulhu

Juve
Oct 7, 2019
44
34
18
The leader gives their turn up to the ganger specialist with the long rifle until I can start getting some better guns/psykers. The grenades are there to control LoS as I go for objectives mostly
 

almic85

Cranky Git
Oct 30, 2014
2,365
4,253
163
Palmerston, ACT, Australia
Why not just find the credits to give the leader a long rifle and then you have two models that can shoot them from different places?

even better give the leader a long rifle and Overwatch and you have someone that can help to protect champions from being wiped out of you don’t get priority.

overseer is at its best when being used to either push close combat monsters into combat or to allow special/heavy weapons to shoot twice. It’s very much wasted on a ganger with a long rifle who is only goito hit half the time and won’t be doing all that much damage even when he does.

I’m not convinced the psychic powers are actually any good. They each have a very niche role, but not enough of one to actually warrant taking. If you can figure out how to make them work I’d love to know.

Smoke grenades are good, but I’m not sure you need that many of them just to cover your approach. You could probably get away with one or two to start and build up from there if needed.
 

Banjulhu

Juve
Oct 7, 2019
44
34
18
In the opening games of a campaign the long rifle is usually more than enough to get work done and as time goes on there will be a lot more melee monsters kicking about (including two house brutes) to really make use overseer and given the nature of the game to have the action converge on a small area of the board the 2 champs will likely end up in the leader's overseer bubble in the early games where they will start to use it.

As to why not having two long rifles. Ultimately it doubles the cost. The reason Overseer leader is considered close to busted is that it lets you double dip without spending the credits.

Psychic powers I'm not truly sold on myself but I think they need testing as they do stuff that is unusual
 

Heart of Storm

Gang Hero
Mar 8, 2019
855
1,286
103
I'm with Almic, drop Overseer, give your BS3+ leader a weapon so he can contribute rather than just helping a BS4+ ganger get shots off, find the points my losing some smoke, you don't need that much as the enemy will be shooting your melee threats, not taking potshots at your gangers and snipers
 
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LorteAnd

Ganger
May 23, 2021
122
65
28
Natch ghoul, I would take spring up over dodge any day and I would give him a grenade or a pistol as back up for when he is standing some where with only one action, it have happened in all my battles, photon flash have been a solid backup, his str4 gives him a good range with it.


I used to be really happy with overwatch/long rifle, but now I'm totally sold on shotgun w execution ammo and overwatch. But it heavily dependent on your tarrain. Throw on a infra sight and you have 3+ to hit some one in heavy cover within 16" on a overwatch shot.


But if I where to bring a long rifle it would be on a guy who can take it as master crafted, it's the best 5 pts I can imagine.

For a psyker a champion with spartial psychosis and psi-touched is dirty cheap for what he can do(as long as you actually have tarrain)


Penumbral mirror is my favourite toy, hands down, I run it on my leader to be sure it works when I have set it up. It might be better on a phantom with psi-touched, he could run as a support role as he could take servant and the new Delaque skills. But my leader is more likely to be in a place where he can use it.

Prospect I would run as cheap as possible til he gets more willpower. Unremeberbel would be great with worm, so I would let him start with that.
 
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Banjulhu

Juve
Oct 7, 2019
44
34
18
Out of all the powers Penumbral Mirror is the only one I can see being useful all the time and the more I look at the powers the more I'm convinced that psy-gheists will be better off ignoring their powers and instead just focusing on powering up their combat stats to make their harness utterly devastating.
 

LorteAnd

Ganger
May 23, 2021
122
65
28
Out of all the powers Penumbral Mirror is the only one I can see being useful all the time and the more I look at the powers the more I'm convinced that psy-gheists will be better off ignoring their powers and instead just focusing on powering up their combat stats to make their harness utterly devastating.
It's just so expensive that you could take another natch ghoul:)
12" pin is very easy to use and the -1 action aura have worked for me, pined and only having one action is brutal.
 

Banjulhu

Juve
Oct 7, 2019
44
34
18
The Natch-Ghul will never have a 3" melee reach however which has an awful lot of value. Ultimately I think I'll want a mix of the two in my gang as a campaign progresses.
 
Apr 17, 2020
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I'm running my natch-ghul with Existential Barrage, so if anyone gets too close he can send them running (if they fail an Int test). It also makes the enemies friends take int tests too if he runs toward them when he flees. The plan is to get my natch-ghul Cravel Howl to make it impossible for them to regroup too.

I dunno how it'll play but if I can cast Existential Barrage, it could be a lot of dice for my opponents to roll. I think there are some really fun options in the psychic powers. They don't seem as op as the harness tho.
 

LorteAnd

Ganger
May 23, 2021
122
65
28
I'm running my natch-ghul with Existential Barrage, so if anyone gets too close he can send them running (if they fail an Int test). It also makes the enemies friends take int tests too if he runs toward them when he flees. The plan is to get my natch-ghul Cravel Howl to make it impossible for them to regroup too.

I dunno how it'll play but if I can cast Existential Barrage, it could be a lot of dice for my opponents to roll. I think there are some really fun options in the psychic powers. They don't seem as op as the harness tho.
When people get to close to my natch-ghoul I kill them with fangs, the natch-ghoul is really good at killing people when they get to close😉

Personally I think the insanity is more fun than existential barrage
 
Apr 17, 2020
22
56
33
Good point...OH! I was getting the Nacht-Ghul mixed up with the psy-ghiest. The psy-giest only has a 4+WS, so their psychic powers are a bit more reliable than their cc attacks.

I took another look at the darkness powers, after reading about the mirror in so many of the posts on this thread. Some juicy powers there. Seems like a lot of fun combos that could work if there were a bunch of psykers in the gang, to mix and match the disciplines.

The thing about the Existential Barrage is that it can effect a bunch of the opponents gang. If it works out you could send a whole flank fleeing into the shadows, where the yacht-ghul is waiting.
 

LorteAnd

Ganger
May 23, 2021
122
65
28
Some how we always have issues about where people flee to when broken, guess it's only gets worse if it also determine where where the big panik hits.. so I have avoided it🙈

Teleport is fun, even short range teleport
 

LorteAnd

Ganger
May 23, 2021
122
65
28
Just realized that the 5" range on the second part of existential barrage also gets +1" pr choir 🤔 that could definitely add up a lot of tests.
 

Banjulhu

Juve
Oct 7, 2019
44
34
18
I dont think it's meant to buff that bit, then again given how loosely and poorly written the psyker rules are who knows.

For example the make people magically blind is side stepped by things like photo-goggles and the blaze condition
 

LorteAnd

Ganger
May 23, 2021
122
65
28
It could be Interested both ways, it's near impossible to guess what the intention have been or if there where any, i don't have the book in front of me, but I'm sure choir is worded as all range measures.
 

LorteAnd

Ganger
May 23, 2021
122
65
28
We have played that it adds to all the range, but the first range measure is the most important.
Btw when you cast it , I think you roll the will power and then you measure and pick a valid target, first we played it like shotting pick target, measure, roll, but I think that was wrong.