Development discussion
- Thread starter TopsyKretts
- Start date
And getting rid of that will be my first suggestion when we get to the campaign rules
spafe
Executive Officer in charge of Hats
Staff member
Necromunda Custodian
Yak Comp 2nd Place
Tribe Council
I'm not sure, but given it's fairly rare for items to have house discounts, can you not jsut have additional rows (not actual rows, but make it a deeper row) so you can have a note saying x gang pays y cost instead. This will cut your totla columns in half
It's not just which gangs have discounts, but also which gangs have it on their house list.
Which is made even more complex in the House books, where each gangs has five or six different lists.
I think it would be worth listing trading post costs in weapon/item descriptions, and leaving gang discounts (if we have them) for the gang rules.
I would still want a stand alone trading post though so it can be easily browsed.
And what exactly do house discounts bring to the game but confusion, broken balance and motivation to min-max with shoe-horned builds? Escher lasgun should not cost differently compared to a, say, cawdor's lasgun which was purchased from market place. Gangs have enough distinction with gang-specific weapons and skill selections.
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I think the idea is to encourage players into a thematic build, without totally railroading them.
Personally, I like the concept.
The problem is that cost and rating are almost one and the same in Necromunda.
Personally, I like the concept.
The problem is that cost and rating are almost one and the same in Necromunda.
Yeah, but I don't like the layout of that
I don't only use this table to look for different costs, but also look for what costs are available from the gang list. This used to be simple, since all gangs before 2020 had a single list per gang. Now all house gangs will have 7-8 different lists, one per fighter class (Leader, 2x champion, 2x juve, ganger, ganger specialist?, possibly some brute options also). So my current trading post table doesn't support that, it only identifies that some item has a cost for some gang, but you would have to look at the separate gang equipment list to know which fighter can pay and use that item. Then it's a huge pain the ass when for example stun grenade has different cost depending on fighter class...
My current layout looks like this:
Would you prefer to have the duplicate cost below Autogun, for a total cost of 5 extra lines? Or would you not be interested in seeing this cost, since it's the same as the Trading Post universal cost?
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It can be really useful to have all costs per gang on a single line if you want to compare gang discounts and gang equipment list availability.
I agree it encourages thematic build. It hasn't been a problem in my group as we don't "abuse" these discounts to min-max. However, I'm willing to throw everything under the buss if we can simplify the game.
What's most annoying is when we get inconsistent prices, for example the stun grenade is a repeat offender:
- Escher pays 25 for stun grenade while it only costs 15 at Trading post.
- Goliath Leader and Stimmer pay 25 while Champion (standard) pays 15.
Why would encouraging thematic build be a good thing? It's called railroading and it's bad.
House-specific discounts are all-cons and no-pros for me, and I'd really like them to go.
I'd be ok with house-specific rarities though.
House-specific discounts are all-cons and no-pros for me, and I'd really like them to go.
I'd be ok with house-specific rarities though.
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The house-specific rarities is something that messes up the layout the most. For some reason GW tried this once for Orlock only:
Orlock column must be extra wide to support that single modification rarity from 10 to 8. What value does this give to the game? How many Orlock gangs have benefitted from getting Mining Laser at rarity 8 instead of 10?!? Madness!
If we however removed gang discounts, it could be feasible to support unique rarities instead. But it's rarely used today, and I'm not sure I want to go into a discussion for adding rarity "discounts" for 400 items spread across 12 gangs!
Orlock column must be extra wide to support that single modification rarity from 10 to 8. What value does this give to the game? How many Orlock gangs have benefitted from getting Mining Laser at rarity 8 instead of 10?!? Madness!
If we however removed gang discounts, it could be feasible to support unique rarities instead. But it's rarely used today, and I'm not sure I want to go into a discussion for adding rarity "discounts" for 400 items spread across 12 gangs!
House-specific rarity happens a lot more than that!
House equipment lists turn a lot or rare items into common items.
House equipment lists turn a lot or rare items into common items.
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I think that if a player has picked a specific gang, then they are already motivated to make a thematic build. Make "thematic" options playable or at least not complete traps and players will gladly diversify their gangs.
Not having each gang's pricing in the table allows it to be smaller.
You could potentially have two columns of equipment.
It's also not feasible when every fighter has their own accessibility and even pricing.
Of course, if we drop those inconsistencies the whole issue becomes slightly redundant, as we would only need to track access. But even then there's too many variables with fighter lists.
You could potentially have two columns of equipment.
It's also not feasible when every fighter has their own accessibility and even pricing.
Of course, if we drop those inconsistencies the whole issue becomes slightly redundant, as we would only need to track access. But even then there's too many variables with fighter lists.
Reverting back to the old gang lists instead of individual fighter lists is one thing I hope to change, or at least have a discussion about. The official rules is a labyrinth when it comes to purchasing and swapping items between fighters. And most of the fighter lists are actually useleses (game mechanically), and serves as little else than a list of suggestions or even assembly instructions for the plastic kits. At least for fighters with Trading Post access. I'm not sure what the best solution is, but it is going to be discussed for sure.
More like a way to inflate book's contents. I don't understand the point of every fighter being extremely restricted with choices. This is Necromunda, crazy customisation is the main charm of it.
Yeah it is a great way to add pages for the numerous books. It is overly complex and GW fails at using this system when they mix up the costs anyway (ref stun grenade).
I think there should be one House list for each house: and it shouldn't include anything which is common.
At gang creation you can pick any common item or anything from your house list. (subject to fighter type restrictions)
After that everything should be bought from the rtrading post to keep things simple.
No discounts for anything (except at creation from the gang lists). No rarity changes for anything or anyone!
At gang creation you can pick any common item or anything from your house list. (subject to fighter type restrictions)
After that everything should be bought from the rtrading post to keep things simple.
No discounts for anything (except at creation from the gang lists). No rarity changes for anything or anyone!
