N18 Exotic Beasts and Overseer

[pixel_SWORDS]

My group ran into this question the other night. When activating the owner of an exotic beast as part of the Overseer skill, does the exotic beast also activate?

We ruled against it on the spot after not being able to find a quick answer. After looking into it today, surprise surprise, Necromunda rules are very ambiguously worded sometimes and I don't have the new rulebook to see what the exact wording of Overseer is or if it changes Exotic Beast wording at all.

HOC p. 58 says, "Group Activation (Exotic Beasts): When a fighter with this special rule is activated, their controlling player must activate all Exotic Beasts belonging to this fighter as well as part of a ‘Group Activation’:
- The controlling player selects and activates each fighter in this group activation as normal, fully resolving each activation before selecting and activating the next. Each fighter activates individually; groups do not activate simultaneously.
- If this fighter itself is activated as part of a Group Activation, this rule still applies, meaning any Exotic Beasts this fighter owns are activated as described above when this fighter is itself activated as part of a Group Activation.

And as far as I know Overseer does: Order (Double): Make a Leadership test for this model. If the test is passed, pick a friendly fighter within 6". That fighter can immediately make two actions as though it were their turn to activate, even if they are not Ready. If they are Ready, these actions do not remove their Ready marker.

That's from an online source so I don't know if it's word for word from the N23 rulebook. Anyone know definitively if Overseer also activates exotic beasts with their owner?

 

[TopsyKretts]

Gut reaction is pets activate everytime ovner activates.

 

[Beebopalulla]

Ahh Pets

Look at the pets some are dependent on their handler. Others are indepedent. You can mixed them ... What will be important is if a menber of a gang who has acces to pets has more then one.

Because then it become a situation where Owner + Pets acte like a subgroup.

For example Champion A has two pets one grapplehawk and one hack cybermastiff. No issue here but you will have to know how to use them properly. Who attack first is an important question.

Other example. Champion B has three giant rats. if you look at rats they have access to the backtab skill and their jaws already has backstab. So in this cases having the rat in a position of efficiently use those backstabing backstab attack is crucial.

And you have the special case like the eshcher prospect who can have pets. The Delaque pets that are use like relay for psychic power.

So yeah, handler activate then the pet or pets but what they do and in what order is more important.

 

[TopsyKretts]

On the other hand, you could target the pet with Overseer?

 

[Beebopalulla]

On the other hand, you could target the pet with Overseer?

you can target the fighter who handle the pet. You can't target the pet with overseer because it's technically handle by some one else. So unless you can overseer yourself...

 

[TopsyKretts]

Huh? The pet is a fighter, and Overseer targets a fighter. Why can't the pet be targeted?

 

[Beebopalulla]

HOC p. 58 says, "Group Activation (Exotic Beasts): When a fighter with this special rule is activated, their controlling player must activate all Exotic Beasts belonging to this fighter as well as part of a ‘Group Activation’

This is why i consider that yes the pets his a fighter but but you activate the fighter who owns who then activates the pets.

So Leader A activates with overseer ganger B who activates 1,2 and 3 but can't activate 1,2, and 3 directly because they belong to B. It will be differents with a brute as a brute does not belong to anyone.

That's how i understand it.

 

[TopsyKretts]

You are completely right, that solves the problem Overseer effectively can't target pets because pets can't activate outside the owner's group activation. Not sure if broken, but if min-maxed this can be used to get a lot of extra activations each round.

 

[pixel_SWORDS]

Yeah this is the issue I foresee running into. Either Overseer can add a lot of activations per round if pets are also activated, or it can help farm XP every round if it doesn't since pets auto pass their rally check when back within 3" of their handler.

 

[TopsyKretts]

Pets don't get XP for rallying - it is known.

 

[Beebopalulla]

Yeah this is the issue I foresee running into. Either Overseer can add a lot of activations per round if pets are also activated, or it can help farm XP every round if it doesn't since pets auto pass their rally check when back within 3" of their handler.

Get out of your mind "the within 3" so many of pets don't follow that rule that it is meaningless. it's much better to read as "within reach of the handler". For the rest it's has already been said no xp....

Pets don't get XP for rallying - it is known.

 

[pixel_SWORDS]

I thought they said in an FAQ that they do? It was in this post where someone asked the Necromunda developers directly. Did it change since then?

 

[Beebopalulla]

I thought they said in an FAQ that they do? It was in this post where someone asked the Necromunda developers directly. Did it change since then?

More than liquely considering there is a new rule book since.

 

[TopsyKretts]

Yeah that's like 4-5 rulebooks ago. Everything changed since then Funny to see how they dealt with it then, saying it is intentional for pets to gain XP when rallying, that this can be abused, but it shouldn't be abused, and if abused, you have to deal with it yourself haha. Now the loophole is shut - no XP for rallying pets this way.

 

[libratorr]

My group ran into this question the other night. When activating the owner of an exotic beast as part of the Overseer skill, does the exotic beast also activate?

We ruled against it on the spot after not being able to find a quick answer. After looking into it today, surprise surprise, Necromunda rules are very ambiguously worded sometimes and I don't have the new rulebook to see what the exact wording of Overseer is or if it changes Exotic Beast wording at all.



And as far as I know Overseer does: Order (Double): Make a Leadership test for this model. If the test is passed, pick a friendly fighter within 6". That fighter can immediately make two actions as though it were their turn to activate, even if they are not Ready. If they are Ready, these actions do not remove their Ready marker.

That's from an online source so I don't know if it's word for word from the N23 rulebook. Anyone know definitively if Overseer also activates exotic beasts with their owner?

Pretty much as you wrote it.
No clarifying text anywhere, but the skill is fine as written.
The Overseen picked fighter hasn't been activated, they just get to make two actions as if it was their turn (not a reaction attack or overwatch action or another interrupt).
If they were activated they would have used their Ready marker and would then get to group activate their exotic Beasts.
Overseer is someone giving commands to someone else to do something, not yeeting their pets along with them. With the added leadership check in the current core rules it's a little less powerful than it used to be, but then so is a fighter getting to fire a heavy weapon twice in the same round.