N18 First build attempt: Enforcers

[Flashard]

Really like the look of the forum so far (one of the NM group I just joined pointed me towards it) and the list building / printing tools are awesome. Decided to go for Palanites (which I incorrectly pronounce Palatines on a regular basis) for our upcoming campaign as I like the story around them, their play style and I can also use them as Space Marine Scouts in 40K LOL.

My very first stab at a list is below. My thoughts on the list are that I wanted to include a Subjugator Sgt now (seeing as I cannot swap to one later) and then buy in other Subjugators later (primarily an SLHG and another GL). I definitely wanted a couple of bolters and a couple of shotguns but once everyone was kitted out I could only afford one shotgun at the moment. Not sure about kitting the sergeant with a sniper rifle or not, I definitely want one and figured the skills the leaders could have would come in useful rather than making a regular officer a sniper. The captain seemed the best guy for the Concussion Carbine but I'm still getting my head around it all, especially the skills, so his might not be the best comination. I did think about Team Work or Threat Response for him. Subjugator Sgt I wasn't sure if Trick Shot or Fast Shot would be better. Overall just trying to build a balanced and survivable list to start racking up credits etc and to avoid anything spammy. I also wasn't sure about the smoke grenades at 15 on the one patrol guy, maybe that would be better buying dum-dums? Also conscious that Subjugator Sergeant is eating a lot of points at 200! I could possibly take off his shield (40), lose the smoke grenades from the Patrol 1 (15) and use the credits to give Patrol 4 a bolter (50) and maybe buy a shotgun later on. Any comments appreciated.

List wise, I haven't included all the stock gear, only the extra purchases and skills with points cost.

Captain: Concussion Carbine / Got Your Six? (170)
Palanite Sgt: Sniper Rifle / Infra Sight / Overwatch? (175)
Patrol 1: Enforcer with Boltgun / Smoke Grenades (135)
Patrol 2: Enforcer with Boltgun (120)
Patrol 3: Enforcer withShotgun (130)
Patrol 4: Enforcer with Stub Gun (plan to equip ASAP with either Shotgun, Bolter or Concussion Carbine depending on other gang make up)(70)

Subjugator Sgt: Grenade Launcher / Vigilus Shield / Trick Shot? (200)

 

[Heart of Storm]

It looks good, in consider ditching the shield on your subjugator to get you pistol patrolman a better weapon, you can buy the shield later..

 

[Flashard]

Thanks. Yeah did some more tinkering today. Managed to do it without ditching the shield but only by giving the patrolman a Concussion Carbine instead of a Shotgun / Bolter. Not yet decided whether I'll keep to this weapon or not. With the points I was trying to recoup to buy the Bolter I bought Photon Flash Grenades for the GL. Only thing I REALLY can't decode on is the skill for the Captain. Pondered Team Leader, not essential for early game but may come in useful down the line with a bigger crew. Threat Response, probably better on a leader that is likely to get closer to enemies. Restraint Protocols, not sure about that one at all. Currently he has 'Got your Six' for an action free Overwatch. Decisions, decisions.

Palanite Captain: Concussion Carbine / Got Your Six (170)

Palantine Sgt: Sniper Rifle / Overwatch (135)
Subjugator Sgt: Grenade Launcher / GL Photon Flash Grenades/ Vigilus Shield / Trick Shot (215)

Patrol 1: Enforcer with Boltgun / Stub Gun dum-dum rounds (125)
Patrol 2: Enforcer with Boltgun / Stub Gun dum-dum-rounds (125)
Patrol 3: Enforcer with Shotgun (130)
Patrol 4: Enforcer with Concussion Carbine (100)

 

[MrAndersson]

No point in having a Grenade launcher if you are not getting Krak grenades for it.

Other than that, the list looks good.

 

[Jumbley]

Pondered Team Leader, not essential for early game but may come in useful down the line with a bigger crew. Threat Response, probably better on a leader that is likely to get closer to enemies. Restraint Protocols, not sure about that one at all. Currently he has 'Got your Six' for an action free Overwatch.

Unless you're running against exclusively melee gangs, you'll almost always get more bang for your buck with Overwatch than with Got Your Six. Overwatch is nearly identical, but can also trigger on any action taken by an enemy model, not just a charge. GYS is better for precisely one situation: you're being charged, and the model doesn't have a Ready token. In all other cases, Overwatch is superior.

IMO, don't bother with Trick Shot: an Infra-Sight is Trick Shot in a can, only better - and it doesn't cost you XP. It's also not a terribly useful skill on a fighter that's packing a template weapon anyway, since he's usually ignoring cover entirely.

Some of that extra equipment isn't doing you a whole lot of good for what you pay: if nothing else, a lot of this stuff you can add later. If you drop the Photon flash on the GL, the shield, and the dum dums, you've got nearly enough credits for a whole other Patrolman (far superior in the early campaign to +1 armour save on a guy with a 4+/3+ save already, or +1 strength on a S3 weapon that only shoots 8"). If nothing else, spending that money on more immediately useful items like Smoke grenades and Infra-sights will get you a better return on investment.

 

[Flashard]

Thanks, very helpful!!

Yeah I plan to by Krak Grenades ASAP, first upgrade probably.

Very interesting about the other comments. Going through them, on the Captain h. I thought you could only take Primary skills as a starting skill, the Cunning list is only Secondary, am I right in thinking he can't take Overwatch?

Good point about overwatch, of the other skills, for template weapons, Fast Shot maybe be better?

I could get to 65 with trimming all that get back but without dropping another weapon I can't really get another Patrolman in unless (bearing in mind this will be my first game) having one of two Patrol men bare bones with Stubbers only doesn't matter? So, I dropped the Shield and Photon Flash for now and put an Infra-sight on the sniper and bought Smoke Grenades for the Grenade Launcher. I'm thinking maybe smoked grenades for the patrolmen might be a good idea too, even thought about dropping a weapon more to afford them but if I did drop a weapon now I'd buy that extra patrolman not the ammo/grenades. I know the credit cost will all be the same ultimately BUT it's easier to amass credits in small bites to but weapons than to save up 70 for a patrolman.

Given the captain has a template weapon too, other than Fast Shot I can't really think of any Skill that stands out to give him. Can't make my mid up yet about restraint protocols so figured Team Leader might be useful down the line once the crew gets bigger. I was wondering also about swapping the captain's Carbine for the Bolter on a patrolman thus giving the captain the longer range weapon to keep him back a bit and put the Carbine on a Patrolman who's likely to be more in the thick of it? Kinda a bit wary about getting the gang leader in harms way early on. If I gave the Captain a non template weapon I could also put Overwatch or Fast Shot on him too vs Team Leader that I still think won't be THAT valuable, at least not until late game. The dum-dum rounds I've only put down seeing as whatever I do I still have 10 points over that I can't think what to do with LOL

Out of interest, how do folks tend to handle putting Subjugators in a crew without the shield modelling wise? Magnetise the shield or put a shield guy down and merely say the shield is not yet equipped.

As it stands now I've got largely two options. This list:

Palanite Captain: Concussion Carbine / Team Work
Palantine Sgt: Sniper Rifle / Infra Sight / Overwatch
Subjugator Sgt: Grenade Launcher / GL Smoke Grenades / Fast Shot
Patrol 1: Enforcer with Boltgun / Stub Gun dum-dum rounds
Patrol 2: Enforcer with Boltgun / Stub Gun dum-dum-rounds
Patrol 3: Enforcer with Shotgun
Patrol 4: Enforcer with Concussion Carbine

and its alternative version

Palanite Captain: Boltgun / Team Work or Overwatch
Palantine Sgt: Sniper Rifle / Infra Sight / Overwatch
Subjugator Sgt: Grenade Launcher / GL Smoke Grenades / Fast Shot
Patrol 1: Enforcer with Boltgun / Stub Gun dum-dum-rounds
Patrol 2: Enforcer with Shotgun
Patrol 3: Enforcer with Concussion Carbine / Stub Gun dum-dum rounds
Patrol 4: Enforcer with Concussion Carbine

But what you said about the extra body got me thinking about what I think might be an even better option. This list gives me an extra patrolman but leaves me with two armed with stubbers only. Maybe not bad as I have the extra bodies that I can then decide how to equip once I see what the other gangs bring rather than have fewer bodies all heavily armed but maybe with not the best spread of weapons. I also managed to point Krak on the GL which I think will be more useful than smoke in the first game or two. Smoke I can purchase early on maybe as hand grenades for Patrolmen rather than tie up the GL firing smoke, at least until I have credits to spare, or a second GL!

Given the better weapons are down I decided to ditch the shotgun for now in favour of the longer range of an extra bolter, I can then add a shotgun (or whatever depending on what the other gangs in the campaign look like) to either the other patrolmen or to rookies. The list still gives me 3 bolters, 1 GL and a Concussion Carbine so not bad in terms of early game firepower. What it does lack is smoke, infra sight on the sniper and no-one has any CC staves or whatever. Of course I'd rather stay out of CC but if it can't be avoided Still, can't expect to have everything straight out the door LOL.


Palanite Captain: Boltgun / Team Work or Overwatch (190)
Palantine Sgt: Sniper Rifle / Overwatch (135)
Subjugator Sgt: Grenade Launcher / GL Krak Grenades / Fast Shot (figured Krak more useful than smoke for now) (195)
Patrol 1: Enforcer with Boltgun (120)
Patrol 2: Enforcer with Shotgun (120)
Patrol 3: Enforcer with Concussion Carbine (100)
Patrol 4: Enforcer with Stub gun (70)
Patrol 5: Enforcer with Stub gun (7)

8 bodies / 1,000

 

[Flashard]

Typo in above list

Palanite Captain: Boltgun / Team Work or Overwatch (190)
Palantine Sgt: Sniper Rifle / Overwatch (135)
Subjugator Sgt: Grenade Launcher / GL Krak Grenades / Fast Shot (figured Krak more useful than smoke for now) (195)
Patrol 1: Enforcer with Boltgun (120)
Patrol 2: Enforcer with Boltgun (120)
Patrol 3: Enforcer with Concussion Carbine (100)
Patrol 4: Enforcer with Stub gun (70)
Patrol 5: Enforcer with Stub gun (70)

8 bodies / 1,000

I did even ponder leaving Krak off the list for now and picking it up as a priority purchase and use the spare credits for a concussion carbine for a patrolman. Figured that the Krak AP might well come in handy though, even early game so decided to keep the flexibility of keeping the main weapons off both the stub armed patrolmen at the moment. I know I can equip 3 weapons anyway but at least I can buy the most useful one first.

 

[Heart of Storm]

I think the most bodies I've managed to squeeze into an Enforcers list is 9

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Cant say I've tested them, and theres no subjugator sergeant but it did lead me to basically thinking concussion carbine/sniper spam is the cheapest way to equip your space cops

 

[Flashard]

Yeah I saw that list, looks worth a try. Quite fancy a Subjugator sergeant at the moment so I might give the last version a whirl I've got a couple of pre-campaign trial games coming up and if this doesn't go to well (hard to see after just one game though) I have aa version of this where the sniper gets Infra sight.

One thing I can't get my head round at all is why you'd ever take a Subjugator Captain?

 

[pathatrick]

Subjugator captains are thematicaly good for shield heavy lists. Puts your leader up there with threat response. Support from concussion carbines and sniper rifles

 

[Flashard]

Subjugator captains are thematicaly good for shield heavy lists. Puts your leader up there with threat response. Support from concussion carbines and sniper rifles

Good point. Be good to use him with a couple of Subjugators with staves and shields I guess. Could even equip the captain with an SLHG I suppose. Being my first list I'm trying to stay away from close combat at first, at least until I know that I'm doing.

 

[Flashard]

As I'm just about the build the Palanites I was wondering how many pistol / stub equipped guys to build? Less critical I suppose with Palanites given they can have 3 weapons so there will likely always be 1 main weapon you can't see. The box art includes 3 armed with pistols I think, seems a bit much given you probably want to upgrade those ASAP mostly so that using the pistols would be a last resort. Wondered if I was missing something with having so many? I was thinking of building:

1 x Concussion Carbine / Stave - Captain
2 x Sniper - Sgt /Patrol
3 x Bolters - Patrol
2 x Shotgun - Patrol / Rookie
1 x Concussion
1 x Pistol / Lumens

Might balance them out some more with a second box in time maybe, just a few with standard weapons then several more fitted with Trading Post regular takes. Impossible to model everything though.

 

[Jumbley]

Going through them, on the Captain h. I thought you could only take Primary skills as a starting skill, the Cunning list is only Secondary, am I right in thinking he can't take Overwatch?

That's right actually - only Sergeants have Cunning as a Primary skill tree, not Captains, my mistake~

Palanite Captain: Boltgun / Team Work or Overwatch (190)
Palantine Sgt: Sniper Rifle / Overwatch (135)
Subjugator Sgt: Grenade Launcher / GL Krak Grenades / Fast Shot (figured Krak more useful than smoke for now) (195)
Patrol 1: Enforcer with Boltgun (120)
Patrol 2: Enforcer with Shotgun (120)
Patrol 3: Enforcer with Concussion Carbine (100)
Patrol 4: Enforcer with Stub gun (70)
Patrol 5: Enforcer with Stub gun (7)

8 bodies / 1,000

I really like this as a starting list - leaves you lots of room to grow, with a solid firebase, and plenty of bodies to keep you in the fight for your first few games. The guys with stub guns are mostly for pairing up with your better equipped patrolmen for support, but they can still do work if you get into close-to-mid-range (and that's our ideal range for Enforcers, somewhere between 10" - 24").

As I'm just about the build the Palanites I was wondering how many pistol / stub equipped guys to build?

From one box, IMO I'd build 2 pistol-wielders - there's two distinct poses for the pistol users in the kit so you at least get both looks, and you'll want a couple for when you end up with an inevitable Rookie that you won't want to give anything to at first aside from dum dums and utility grenades.

Eventually, you're gonna want to end up with at least a few more Palanites - the combo-set from Dark Uprising with palanites and subjugators together is still going for a decent price online, and that's pretty much all you'll need to fill out a set of models that can represent whatever gang layout you go with.

 

[Flashard]

@Jumbley Thanks so much for the advice, very helpful. Actually I've read back through almost all of your Palanite posts and they've been very influential in helping form my list(s) and getting my head round these guys. I'll go with the final list to start I'll post back how it goes, just as much for my own reference as anything LOL.

Good point about building two pistol guys, the poses look cool too. For now I'll probably drop one of the Sniper builds to do another pistol, at least until I get hold of another sprue of Enforcers. If I desperately need a sniper in the meantime I can always proxy a Space Marine Scout Sniper in cloak until I get the extra Palanite sprue. Not sure about the dual pistol guy though? I can see the value at a push but I think It'd be better to save up credits to buy a better weapon than blow them on a second stub, again, unless I'm missing something?

I'm also considering changing Team Work for the captain, it's only one more activation than other gangs (albeit that might come in useful down the line if the gang grows and I get to add an SLHG), can't recall off my head if the leader gets to activate as well, making it 4 in total? Either way, at first I'm thinking of going with Fast Shot (2 shots) or Trick Shot (reduce cover benefit) which I think might be more useful early game. Our House Rules allow selection of Primary or Secondary Skills so I could always put Team Work on the Leader down the line if I REALLY needed that extra one activation, or add Overwatch etc. A few practice games might also give me some idea if I think that extra activation will be more useful than Trick / Fast before the campaign starts.

Of course, just dawned on me, put either Trick or Fast on him now then add Team Work further down the line, he can already do two activations without the skill, might be enough for now.

I've already got a box of 6 subjugators, do you think there's a need for more? I was planning to build them as:

1 x Captain (though equipped how I'm not sure, other than GLs it's a bit limited, at least until you get to the Trading Post)
1 x SLHG
2 x Grenade Launcher / Shield
2 x Shock Stave / Shield

Only thing that's not in there is the Concussion Ram but I can probably proxy the SLHG for that (looks cooler IMO), doubt I'd ever need both. Captain I think I'll hardly ever use TBH and even then he might be a GL / SLHG Captain. Giving a captain a stave and a shield seems a massive points sink unless going really CC heavy and I'll likely not be looking to do that in a hurry. Otherwise, can't see me wanting more than 2 GLs (don't want to lose friends with GL (or Bolter / Concussion) spam) and definitely no more than two Stave / Shield guys.

 

[Flashard]

View media item 45103
Even did them a swanky Gang Image banner, blowed if I can work out the voodoo needed to get it to display other than mega-zoomed in of the SWAT logo in Campaign View.

 

[Haematic]

Loving this thread and hope you don’t mind @Flashard but basically robbing the list everyone helped you with. One cheeky question / request - are the shields worth having and how would you work it into the above list? Ta!!

 

[Flashard]

@Haematic LOL, welcome, hope it work out for you, let me know if you get to trial it before I do. My only concern with the list is that I have no smoke either by way of hand grenade or GL. I was tempted to drop the Concussion Carbine to give me another 30 points to equip smoke grenades x 2 and buy the CC later. Trouble is, if other gangs manage to make it to melee range, the carbine will go quite a way to mitigating that threat. Dropping other weapons for me was not really an option and I would rather keep the Krak, despite its cost.

For me, at the moment (and bear in mind this is all theorymunda LOL) I couldn't get enough shields into the gang considering they're 40 each, without going a) CC heavy and b) dropping at least 2, if not 3, gang members which would be a big risk WRT bottle tests IMO. If we keep going long enough I might well add a two man shield/stave team if I can but at around 330 credits I'd probably be looking to add a shield to the GL ASAP and then add in an SLHG or even look to an Ambot.

What I decided to do with the subjugators did change how I built them though. I originally planned to build:

1 Captain - stub gun / shield
2 GL with shields
2 with stave / shield
1 SLHG

I then got to thinking if I ever took a Sub captain I'm at the very least going to equip him with something more than a stub gun, like anything more! Doubt I'd use a GL captain (and even if I did I could use one of the SJ troopers as a captain) and doubt I'd use him for a Concussion Ram or SLHG, again, if I needed to, I could use the SJ trooper SLHG. So I opted for another shield / stave. This would give me the option of a three man CC team as a snatch squad (albeit of course the Sgt or captain, the captain model could be used as either, would need to be there at team creation). So my Subjugators were eventually built as below:

1 SJ Captain -stave / shield
2 SJ with stave / shield
2 SJ GL with shields (one magnetised shield)
1 SJ with SLHG

Only thing I didn't build was a Heavy Concussion Ram which I might regret but I figured I could always proxy the SLHG. Can't see me taking the Ram over the SLHG though, despite it getting Blast 3 in the FAQ, so I'm hoping it won't be an issue.

View media item 45096

 

[Flashard]

For what it's worth the options I built from the Palanite Enforcer box were:

3 x Bolter (1 as a Captain)
2 x Shotgun
2 x Concussion Carbine (one holding a stave and the other a stub gun)
1 x Sniper
2 x Pistol

I'll likely pick up another box of enforcers to build another bolter or two, another shotgun or two, 1 more sniper, a dual pistol guy and maybe a stave/ carbine captain, that'll leave me 3-4 figures left to model with what I'm most likely going to look to take from the Trading Post. I read several posts with folks saying they were building as per the box art / instructions but for me there's too many bolters (4) for what I need now, only 1 shotgun, 1 too many pistols and only one, the captain, armed with a Concussion Carbine whereas as for now I only want patrolmen with Carbines.