Gorkamorka FAQ

Flamekebab

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I just played a 'quick' demo game with my gf, but it turns out it wasn't so quick due to extreme rustiness on the rules - lots of flicking through the book looking for answers.
A very familiar situation! If I ever get around to making the videos I have planned I hope that they'll be useful as refreshers.


1) Where are the rules for Bottle Tests? I know they exist somewhere, but still can't find them even after a post-game look.
Page 89 of Da Uvver Book (y)

2) p. 34 has rules for vehicles without drivers. I assume these also apply when the driver is merely down? It does actually refer to being pinned, so I would guess so, but it seems an odd example, because neither pinned nor down amounts to being without a driver.
By the wording it looks like "without" isn't meant literally. Any kind of effect that renders the driver unable to act as normal is presumably covered under the "or whatever" bit.

3) The aforementioned section also directs you to p. 44 for attempts by other crew to take over the steering wheel. It says that they can do this on a 4+. However, this section only refers to when a driver has been thrown overboard and it seems to be written on the assumption that an enemy boarder is still on board the vehicle.
It does refer to specifically being thrown overboard but by the "or whatever" wording from above it seems reasonable that other incapacitating conditions also apply.

3a) Can another model (attempt to) take over driving when the driver is merely pinned/down and not overboard?
Again, I would say that the "taking over" rules are probably written to deal with vehicles that are effectively without a driver so yes.

3b) Do you need the 4+ test if there are no boarders present? (It's not clear whether this represents the difficulty of taking control with an enemy on board or simply the difficulty of taking control full stop.)
Yes. The rules stipulate that drawn combatants can't take over (and those who lose are automatically thrown overboard) so that leaves only crewmen who either didn't fight or who won. Warriors who won their combat will have thrown the losing fighters off. The test represents the warrior trying to get the vehicle under control (further evidenced by the fact that if they fail they get another chance every turn until they succeed).
 
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Azzabat

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The Bottlin' Out rules are in Da Uvver Book, Pg 89

"If a mob loses 25% of its fighters, the rest of the mob will start thinking about running off. Count up the number of warriors and vehicles in the mob. Once the mob has lost at least a quarter of this number, it will start taking Bottle tests at the start of each of its subsequent turns."

"To take a Bottle test, the mob’s Nob must pass a standard Leadership test. If the Nob is down or out of action (or otherwise not present), test on the warrior with the highest Leadership who is still in action. If the Leadership test is passed, the mob fights on regardless of its losses. If the Leadership test is failed, the mob has lost all heart for the fight and runs away."

If a model is down they can do nothing but crawl up to 2" so a vehicle with a downed driver would count as out of control.

Vehicles who's drivers are pinned are classed as Out Of Control (pg 34 of the rule book)

VEHICLES WITHOUT A DRIVER

If a vehicle is left without a driver for any reason (because he has been pinned, thrown overboard, or whatever) the vehicle will slew randomly immediately and in each subsequent movement phase until the driver is replaced.The vehicle swerves 45° left or right (roll a D6 – 1-3 = left, 4-6 = right) and moves D6" forward. This is the only movement a driverless vehicle can make during its turn.

You can only attempt to take control of a vehicle if the driver is down (not pinned) or thrown overboard. If you are free to do so (i.e. not in combat, pinned, down etc) then it's a 4+ roll to take control of the vehicle.

Hope this helps.

= )
 

Ben_S

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Thanks @Flamekebab and @Azzabat

I think I did have a quick look in Da Uvver Book, but obviously my problem was assuming that Bottle Tests would be in Da Roolz. I guess it would have been easier to find things if I was using a PDF rather than the original books. I'd forgotten how badly organised these things are.

You can only attempt to take control of a vehicle if the driver is down (not pinned) or thrown overboard. If you are free to do so (i.e. not in combat, pinned, down etc) then it's a 4+ roll to take control of the vehicle.
Out of interest, where do you get the bolded bit from?

The rules for taking over a vehicle only mention thrown overboard, so I could see an argument for saying you can't take over in any other circumstances (pinned, down, etc). Conversely, the vehicle is considered 'without a driver' if the driver is pinned (that's explicit on p. 34), so I can see the alternative logic that says someone else can take over whenever the vehicle is without a driver.

I don't see anything that distinguishes between a driver who is down and one who is merely pinned. (Obviously this doesn't matter that often - I haven't checked Digganob to see whether there are additional rules in there for pinned drivers.)
 
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Flamekebab

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It's interesting that pinning is mentioned in the context of drivers. Orks don't get pinned. Other factions do but at the time the original books were released the only models affected by pinning were grots. Perhaps they can be drivers?
 

DracoPT

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1) they are in Da Uvver Book page 89 in the Scenarios section

2) In page 63 of Da Roolz it has the rules for when the driver is pinned or down but I supose it happens the same to him as to the crew in page 62

3a) it's like I said in the question 2)

3b) I guess the 4+ needs to be taken regardless of being enemies on board or not
 

Azzabat

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Thanks @Flamekebab and @Azzabat
Out of interest, where do you get the bolded bit from?
I was writing in response to Ork vehicles because (as Flamekebab says) Orks can't be pinned, so in effect the only time you could take over control of an Ork vehicle with it's driver still on board would be if the driver were down.

With Grots and Diggas the pinning would come into effect. Sorry for any confusion.

= )
 
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Ben_S

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I was writing in response to Ork vehicles because (as Flamekebab says) Orks can't be pinned
Ah, ok, I get you now. I thought you were saying that it's only possible to take over steering when the driver is down or out, but not when he's merely pinned. I take it that someone can takeover from a pinned driver, it's merely that this isn't a common circumstance, because Orks don't get pinned.

It's interesting that pinning is mentioned in the context of drivers. Orks don't get pinned.
Yes, this is part of why I thought it was an odd example. Still, they clearly had Digganob in mind when writing the base game, so perhaps it's only there with the future in mind. Of course, I don't recall any rules saying that you can't use a Grot as a driver (or gunner). I doubt I'd ever do it, because it seems wrong, but you probably could justify it with fluff (e.g. the Orks want to get fighting, so relegate Grots to the thankless task of driving).

Anyway, thanks to everyone for help. I guess I need to re-read the rules thoroughly before our next game.
 
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Ben_S

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Forgive the double-post; I couldn't see how to add another quote whilst editing my previous post.

2) In page 63 of Da Roolz it has the rules for when the driver is pinned or down but I supose it happens the same to him as to the crew in page 62
A good spot, thanks. The vehicle damage tables actually seem to have clearer details here than the main section of the rules! I guess I should have been reading that bit, instead of only looking at the result rolled. But it's not clear whether the driver does fall off, like other crew - I could see logic either way.

Also, when it says that the vehicle will swerve and move randomly if the driver goes down, does this apply even if it was stationary (but not immobile)? That was another bit we were unsure on but, not seeing anything saying otherwise, we assumed the driver slumps onto the accelerator or something. Of course, this logic only makes sense if he doesn't fall off like crew. If the driver does fall off, it's puzzling how the vehicle starts itself...
 

DracoPT

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I think that's when logic or our own way to see the thing starts to show, and we need to remember that's orks we're talking about, everything is possible!

Now in my opinion (you can disagree anywhere you want, it's just a matter of talking with your gaming group because it's a game where the rules can change if you have more fun like that ;) )
I could guess if the vehicle is stationary then it doesn't swerve because I see as he just let go the steering wheel and it loses control.
About the driver going down, I think he can fall from the vehicle because when he goes down other crewmember can take control of the wheel in the rules, it doesn't make sense the original driver still being in his seat when the other guy took his place
 
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ineptmule

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I may have been playing it wrong all these years but I thought that a model, driver or crew, that goes down on a vehicle is thrown overboard immediately. That makes it unnecessary to distinguish between pinning and down as you can never be down on a vehicle.

I got this idea from the section about hand to hand combat on a vehicle, so it may well not apply to injuries from shooting. I feel it makes the game work a bit better though, as it keeps vehicles uncluttered from models lying on their fronts and helps get the lads off their shiny metal battleships and out into da desert.
 
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Azzabat

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Playing Orks the issue of pinned drivers never came up (as they were just automatically 'bounced' off the vehicle, but I like your idea of pinned models being 'bounced' too. I'm going to start using that.
 

Ben_S

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p. 43 says someone who loses hth combat is thrown overboard, whether or not they go down. I don't see anywhere that says you go overboard simply as a result of being shot (i.e. when you would be pinned).

p. 62 the 'crew' location specifies that anyone going down falls off, but the driver location on p. 63 doesn't say this - the implication being, I take it, that they don't (though they presumably don't have seatbelts, they at least have a seat and maybe some form of cabin).
 
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Azzabat

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I was intending to convey the point that Orks don't get pinned so they are either fully functional or wounded. As Ben_S rightly says pg 62 states if you lose combat (or go down) on a vehicle you are automatically 'bounced' off of it. We have always included the driver in this just like any other model. I like the image of the driver suddenly diving out the door as the windscreen explodes in a shower of glass and he gets hit and wounded even if he has more than 1 wound. Maybe I'm just being fanciful.

I definitely need to state in future the differences between when I'm talking about House Rules my group uses, and the actual GoMo rules. :oops:
 

ineptmule

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Cool well that is how we always played it. Seeing as people seem to agree that downed models get thrown off the vehicle, I feel that the driver should be included in this in the absence of any further information to the contrary.

Additionally though, for models that can be pinned, I would be inclined to say they STAY on their vehicle as this differentiates the two outcomes.
 

Kon-rad

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Cool well that is how we always played it. Seeing as people seem to agree that downed models get thrown off the vehicle, I feel that the driver should be included in this in the absence of any further information to the contrary.

Additionally though, for models that can be pinned, I would be inclined to say they STAY on their vehicle as this differentiates the two outcomes.
The League of Diggaz, Grotz and Other Weedy Skumboz heartily supports ineptmule's interpretation. Though it would be easy to argue against it. There is an extensive description of pinned models having to make IN tests when within 2" of a drop or take falling damage.
The whole "down models get thrown" rule is easy to miss. It's not in the rules themselves, just a note on the damage table. We played a good half dozen games before we caught it.
 

ineptmule

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Well we're straying away from clarifying rules for FAQ and making up our own stuff, but with the precedent of taking I tests when pinned near ledges etc. you could at least make it an I test when pinned on a vehicle. Certainly being auto-ejected feels quite punitive. Although hilarious.
 

Ben_S

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Seeing as people seem to agree that downed models get thrown off the vehicle, I feel that the driver should be included in this in the absence of any further information to the contrary.
I don't see the logic of saying that two cases that are described differently should be treated the same 'in the absence of any further information to the contrary'. The different description is evidence to the contrary. It's clearly stated that downed crew fall off. There's no such statement regarding drivers, which surely suggests that they don't. If they were intended to do so then presumably that statement would be repeated.

Of course, it's not explicitly stated that drivers don't fall off, but lots of things aren't explicitly stated, e.g. nothing says that my Nob can't order an orbital barrage. There's no need for anything saying I can't, because there's nothing that says I can't. Similarly, there's no need for anything saying that drivers don't fall off, because there's nothing that says they do. (This is assuming, of course, that I've not missed anything here - but you're not suggesting that I have.)

As @Azzabat demonstrates, you can house-rule whatever you like, but this thread is for questions about the rules, not suggested house rules. Adding things to the rules just because the rules as written don't have anything to the contrary, is house-ruling it, rather than interpreting the rules.
 
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