N18 Imperial Imposters - Master Charlatan (Book of Judgement, p13, p15)

[SirWalterManny]

Am I missing something obvious?

P13: “When choosing an alliance in which to enter into, an Outlaw gang may select from one of the following:.... Imperial Imposters”
- Only Outlaw gangs can have an alliance with them. Law abiding gangs may not.

P15: [Imperial Imposters: Drawbacks] “During the post-battle sequence, if the gang fielded a Master Charlatan they must roll a d6. On a 6, their association has been discovered and the gang is outlawed”

If only an outlaw gang can ally with Imperial Imposters and thus take a Master Charlatan, how can the risk of being outlawed be a drawback?

 

[Paupoi]

Correct me if I'm wrong as I only skimmed through the book still but I believe allying with the imposters lets you act like a law abiding gang. Probably for rackets using and intrigues.

If not then it's silly as hell and totally believable considering the errata in past books.

 

[Baffo]

What are the DRAWBACKS of being an Outlawed gang? (haven't gotten my copy of the book yet due to delays in delivery to my local shop where I pre-ordered it).
I have seen a table of benefits for both Outlaws and Law-abiding gangs in relation to their Reputation, but haven't seen anything about what being oulawed actually costs you (or is it just a matter of role playing allignment?).

 

[SirWalterManny]

Correct me if I'm wrong as I only skimmed through the book still but I believe allying with the imposters lets you act like a law abiding gang. Probably for rackets using and intrigues.

If not then it's silly as hell and totally believable considering the errata in past books.

I havent see that that I recall. Ive also only skimmed over the rackets/intrigues bit though so will keep looking ... although even if being allied to them allowed you to use law-abiding intrigues without penalty, not sure that would help make sense of how a a drawback of becoming outlawed would make sense if you had to be an outlaw gang anyway just to ally with them (even if they then gave you the appearance of being law-abiding for use of intrigues)

 

[SirWalterManny]

What are the DRAWBACKS of being an Outlawed gang? (haven't gotten my copy of the book yet due to delays in delivery to my local shop where I pre-ordered it).
I have seen a table of benefits for both Outlaws and Law-abiding gangs in relation to their Reputation, but haven't seen anything about what being oulawed actually costs you (or is it just a matter of role playing allignment?).

Don’t have book on me, but if I recall includes:

- house gangs which are outlawed cant take house favours or house specific pets/brutes.
- penalty (or possibly just restriction on) for using ‘law abiding’ intrigues
- your gingers have a bounty on their head (I think more creds for opponent that kills them in game?)
- can only take hired guns and hangers on etc which have an ‘outlaw’ trait (both a benefit cos you have access to them, and a drawback as you cant then hire those which don't)
- alliances: law-abiding gangs=guilds, outlaw=crime syndicates etc.

Quite like the drawbacks and benefits... all very thematic and add to both narrative and have an effect on campaign, but the drawback I’ve highlighted with the Imperial Imposters doesn’t seem to make sense, unless I’ve missed something.

 

[Vonvilkee]

You also suffer penalties to the rare trade roll for the trading Post.

When you change alignment (which can happen forcibly even back to law abiding) you lose 3 rep which impacts your benefits from that chart. Completing intrigues can force checks.

 

[John Compton]

Correct me if I'm wrong as I only skimmed through the book still but I believe allying with the imposters lets you act like a law abiding gang. Probably for rackets using and intrigues.

If not then it's silly as hell and totally believable considering the errata in past books.

Nothing in there (that I saw) about acting as a law-abiding game because of the imposters.

I was a bit puzzled by this one too at first look, but it seems like there would be plenty or opportunity to be an outlaw gang, scoop up an imposter follower, and then flip to being law-abiding. Not sure if that was the intention but it's not bad narratively. The charlatan is also pretty incredible play-wise, so maybe the benefit/drawback being a narrative edgecase is the point. You really want that alliance for the badass fighter that comes with it.

 

[EAfirstlast]

- your gingers have a bounty on their head

And the oppression of redheads continues! Equality for gingers!

 

[SirWalterManny]

And the oppression of redheads continues! Equality for gingers!

All are equally worthless in the underhive.

 

[SirWalterManny]

So, reading back over entry for Imperial Imposters (p15):

BENEFITS: "An Honourable Word: While the gang is allied with an Imperial Imposter they can protect themselves or another gang from being outlawed"
- each week, can ignore one action that would result in them becoming outlawed.

So both a benefit and a drawback for this alliance seem to intend that a 'law abiding' gang can take this alliance', or at the least, it allows an outlaw gang to take on the appearance of being law-abiding. Both would work narratively.

there would be plenty or opportunity to be an outlaw gang, scoop up an imposter follower, and then flip to being law-abiding.

@John Compton

I think that's the intention, but switching alignment has quite a cost... one being risking losing the alliance (p39 - must immediately test the allliance with a +3 modifier). Agree the Charlatan is great, but think this needs an faq or house rule.

 

[Neil McLellan]

Yeah, it seems like if you are supposed to switch should help you go legit too. As is, seems like it was supposed to be for law abiding gangs.

 

[TopsyKretts]

Copied this text from a discussion about errors in the judgement book (https://yaktribe.games/community/th...the-book-of-judgement.9166/page-2#post-204630):

If you change alignment, you have to test the alliance rolling 2D6, adding 3 to the roll. In addition, add +1 each time you test the alliance previously.

On a 7+, the alliance is broken. So you need to roll 1-4 on 2D6 if you never tested the alliance before? If you switch alignment, this is the chance to keep the alliance:

Tested Alliance 0 times before: 16.6% (83.3% change to break the alliance)
Tested Alliance 1 times before: 8.3% (91.6% change to break the alliance)
Tested Alliance 2 times before: 2.7% (97.2% change to break the alliance)

Also checkout the drawback for Imperial Imposters: Each time you use the Charlatan in battle, you roll a D6, and on a 6 you gang is outlawed. If you don't switch alignment, this drawback has no effect.

 

[Neil McLellan]

It should have a additional rule that if you switch alignment to law abiding, you don’t have to test alliance.
Rules as Written:“I have a brilliant plan, I shall pretend to be an Important Uphive Person! In order to really sell it, I will hang around with well known criminals and fraudsters!”

 

[Tiktaalik]

pg 126 Necrodamus. if I understand this correctly: If I am affiliated with the imposters, I am allowed to take the items that the charlatan has from the Armory to equip my leader when forming a gang. In addition I am also allied with them, meaning that MC may join the gang at some point. Seems kind of broken?

 

[TopsyKretts]

You choose Imperial Imposters as Affiliation, so your equipment list will be fairly limited! But you mean overpowered because you treat falsehood as common? I think the equipment list is for the gang, unless I misunderstood the official rules. The alliance part gives you limitations of who you can be allied with. So that's optional, but yes, you can be allied with them.

 

[Tiktaalik]

Thanks for the reply.
RAW the leader is equipped like the MC, but the rest of the gang is given the normal equipment list, with champions having access to Rare 8 items from the armory. The options are limited, but they are (on paper at least) items one would take if given the option.

 

[TopsyKretts]

My understanding was that you can choose different aspects of the outcast gang (mostly) independently of each other:

• Leader: any fighter in the game, can be master charlatan but doesn't have to be
• Gang: As normal
• Affiliation: choose any affiliation, can be recidivist (imperial imposter) but doesn't have to be

I'm not taking delegation gangs into account here, as that will remove the options for choosing leader and affiliation.