Kill Teams 2018

DerekDecker

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Apr 1, 2017
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SW:A is confirmed dead and buried.
The reason this edition KT get a release this big is solely because SW:A surprise success. Otherwise it would probably be a "lol just 8th edition with single model as unit, btw buy the codex for point value". It is the spiritual successor to SW:A in a way.

SW:A belong to the pit of GW anually one-off game such as : Assassinorium Exec Force, Lost Patrol, Gang of Commoragh, IK Renegade etc. Long term support is out of the picture.
 

Ml2sjw

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I know their has been the image of the rule book but all the other images of the "rogue trader" game don't seem to match the descriptions of kill team, there are a lot more than ten models a side in the images we have seen...
 

Ardavion

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Nov 22, 2011
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It's not a good sign that we are still waiting for the full N17 rules and Games Workshop releases another skirmish game.
Given the sheer amount of stuff they've established will be available (even at this "pre-pre-order" stage) and the thought put into the numerous kill teams available, I'd be given to thinking this has been in the pipeline for a long time, probably even longer than N17.

It does help, ironically, that there have been more versions of Kill Team than Necromunda, as they'll have had a broad base to start from, and they've admitted they've used a lot of their previous "skirmish offerings" to create the latest iteration's ruleset.

As an aside, it doesn't seem surprising that the biggest difference between this and previous versions is (supposedly) a drive to support the game:
ONGOING SUPPORT

This is just the beginning for Kill Team. This is a fully fledged Warhammer system that we’ll be supporting for years to come with rules, models, expansions and more – not to mention organised play, store tourneys and independent events. You can get started with Kill Team in confidence that we’ll be providing continuing support for your hobby.
Which is to say "We realise that Shadespire - the one skirmish level game that we released a lot of content for quickly to provide variety and also ran tournaments for to get the community involved has been the most successful skirmish game we've put out for decades, so we'll emulate that a bit".

I can emphasise with the sentiment of "WTF GW, finish one game before you put out another", but it may simply be that Kill Team has had a bigger team working on it for a longer period of time.
 

Sethmerlin666

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I know their has been the image of the rule book but all the other images of the "rogue trader" game don't seem to match the descriptions of kill team, there are a lot more than ten models a side in the images we have seen...
In the FAQ on the KillTeam page it specifically mentions the upcoming Rogue Trader expansion. The monster side of that team certainly seems bigger, I'm still hoping that might be a solitaire mode (i'm a lonely man).
 
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DerekDecker

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I wish each Rogue trader actually had 2, 3 weapon options to choose from. But nah they're probably monopose, mono-option kit.
 

Ml2sjw

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In the FAQ on the KillTeam page it specifically mentions the upcoming Rogue Trader expansion. The monster side of that team certainly seems bigger, I'm still hoping that might be a solitaire mode (i'm a lonely man).
Fair enough I hadn't seen that. I was expecting it to be a bit more like Warhammer quest based on one picture. That said it might be intended to be more narrative based, it may well be that the rule set is flexible enough to enable this. Interestingly GW are currently hiring a games designer to work on blood bowl and necromunda sepcifically so their is still hope
 
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Thorgor

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I can emphasise with the sentiment of "WTF GW, finish one game before you put out another", but it may simply be that Kill Team has had a bigger team working on it for a longer period of time.
I think it had a bigger team, but I doubt they have been working for longer.

We know that N17 was already in development when SW:A was released (both were developped because of the Sector Mechanicus terrain: SW:A was made to sell it and it enabled N17). Since KT18 was probably developped in response to the unexpected popularity of SW:A and by the same team responsible for Shadespire (a game released soon before N17), I think it's safe to say N17 was already in the works when they began working on it.

Since KT18 is a core GW game and didn't need new minis to be designed especially for it, I'm sure they could develop it way faster than the two and half guys from Specialist Games who had to write all the rules and design brand new minis for all the gangs.
 

Ml2sjw

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Plus kill Team is a smart business move. It opens up a revenue stream based on old models(the development costs of which have presumably all ready been covered) and gets people who don't have time money or space to play full 40k into the game and buying models.
 

MusingWarboss

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Oct 31, 2013
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Necromunda still is my favourite GW game. I get the points at the top of the page about 40k units appearing bland but really, way back in 1st Ed everything could be characterful. It still can be if you apply the same logic to them as you do Necromunda. They don’t have to be sterile tournament playing pieces (although tournament is mention in new KT).

What hasn’t helped is the locked in game system which prevents more customisation solely because you’re co-opting in models designed for a different game into a new one. Necro at least has its own models. SW:A is fun but it sorely lacked a full proper campaign system and even the ability to get non-Army specific weapons. That will probably apply to new Kill Team too. To some extent it also applies to N17 with the House Lists but I won’t go there in this thread!!! ;)

I still want to play SW:A, much like old Necromunda but as always it will boil down to what the rest of my friends want to do. I have a feeling though that new Kill Team will kill off not just SW:A but N17 for me. Muddled rules at a game night compared to one book and appropriate expansion boxes? Potential to use existing models? It’s not like conversions are always 40k -> Necro either! I can see Necro -> 40k unit already in a friends Arbites made from Van Saar!

I know my Blanchitsu mate already is waiting to jump ship to this new Rogue Trader.
 

MusingWarboss

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These two games are for two very different kinds of hobbyists. It's like the difference between 40K and Horus Heresy. I'm just glad we finally have a real 40K skirmish game so people can stop trying make N17 into something it's not. *shrug*
I agree, 40k main universe vs Necromunda should be very different! That’s been one of my big grumbles about N17 though, the power creep of the gangs from N95’s worthless scum trying to eek out a name to N17’s almost paramilitary forces. So I hope those making Necromunda into something it’s not includes the current designers!!

I do hope that a lot of the "exclusive" cards from the different box sets are just reference material though. I don't want to have to buy the Ork box just to get the rules for the servohaulers (although I will of course).
Errr, well, perhaps. That’s precisely the model used for N17 though! Want new tile sections? Buy them. No rules included, you’ve got to buy GW2 even if you want nothing else in the book.

They had started to put some rules into boxes for 40k. If these are rules specific to Kill Team though then I guess it’s buy the box. Equally what if you already have all the Miniatures in these expansions and just want the rules and cards?? eBay??

The models are supposed to be coloured plastic now though to give them more of a team look out of the box. A concept I actually quite like! Shame they aren’t new sculpts though, the Orks need plastic Kommandos!! They could have done a Shadespire and sold them later then if they wanted to.
 
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Thorgor

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Sigh...

Most of N17 shortcomings have nothing to do with the kind of game it is or deliberate design choices. They are the result of bad/lazy/rushed design and lack of playtesting and proofreading, something I have hopes KT18 won't suffer from considering the team behind it is also responsible for Shadespire, a very well written and playtested game.

I will concede that KT18, due to its slightly different nature, will be inherently able to achieve better balance than Necromunda (as it's likely to have less moving parts), but it doesn't mean that the balance in N17 couldn't or shouldn't be improved.
 

Aulenback

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Mar 29, 2016
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Halifax, NS, Canada
The reason this edition KT get a release this big is solely because SW:A surprise success. Otherwise it would probably be a "lol just 8th edition with single model as unit, btw buy the codex for point value". It is the spiritual successor to SW:A in a way.

SW:A belong to the pit of GW anually one-off game such as : Assassinorium Exec Force, Lost Patrol, Gang of Commoragh, IK Renegade etc. Long term support is out of the picture.
Really, I admit to viewing SW:A as a simple 'gangs expansion' for Necromunda/GorkaMorka. Additional Outlander gangs to expand on your Ash Wastes cross-compatibility. Thus the under-developed campaign system - it wasn't necessary since the campaign system already exists.
 

DerekDecker

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Apr 1, 2017
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The original Necromunda 2017 designer is a freelance who left after his work ended, to form his own company. So GW had to call in other people to keep the job going. Rumour of a pushy deadline and stressful work environment also floating around.

For me it's feel like the Specialist Game division (especially N17) is GW's unwanted adopted child, Like really, the reason they said no digital booklet is because....digital division didn't have time for them?????!???

"Err son, plastic gang kit is all you get, now shoo, FW will take care of the rest, don't waste my money!"-meanwhile at GW's factory, more exclusive-event only plastic stormcast and marine characters are being made.
 
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