(NCE) question about hiding

luster

Juve
Mar 23, 2014
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I just had a game where my opponent claimed that if a model started the turn in hiding, he would remain in hiding so long as he maintained at least partial cover from any of my models' line of sight, and did not run (but still moved). Is this accurate, or does hiding require a greater level of obstruction? Full cover? Out of line of sight completely?

The rules say:
A model may stay hidden over several turns so
long as it remains behind a concealing wall or
similar feature. It may even move around behind
cover so long as it remains concealed while it
does so. If an enemy moves into a position where
he would clearly be able to see the hidden fighter,
then the model cannot claim to be hidden any
longer and the counter is removed.

Does 'clearly seen' mean there is no cover at all?

Cheers,
 

Fold

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Oct 26, 2013
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It's not clearly defined and Hiding in general is one of the main problem areas in the rules which is why it's the subject of an ongoing discussion.

Your opponents interpretation probably isn't uncommon - note that the only requirement to go into hiding in the first place is to be "behind a low wall" which you could in theory reasonably assume would be partial cover and there may not be any reason why remaining in hiding would require a greater degree of cover than going into hiding in the first place.

But ultimately it's currently up to you and your opponent to reach an agreement, or have your campaign arbiter make a ruling.
 
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Anthony

Community Edition Editor
Jun 2, 2011
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The key phrase for me is "in a position where a person might reasonably conceal himself". There are instances of partial cover where you couldn't hide behind, like a lamp post or chain-link fence, but I think it's conceivable you could hide behind a low lying barricade by crawling or if he's on the fringe of a solid bulkhead.

I'm not sure it would be such a bad thing if it was restricted to being in cover though (i.e. partial cover would never be enough). Might make out-manoeuvring the enemy a more inviting tactic.
 

Ben_S

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It's not clearly defined and Hiding in general is one of the main problem areas in the rules which is why it's the subject of an ongoing discussion.
For the OP's benefit, there's six pages of discussion here:
https://yaktribe.games/community/threads/hiding-quiz.5427/

The rules say:
A model may stay hidden over several turns so
long as it remains behind a concealing wall or
similar feature. It may even move around behind
cover so long as it remains concealed while it
does so. If an enemy moves into a position where
he would clearly be able to see the hidden fighter,
then the model cannot claim to be hidden any
longer and the counter is removed.

Does 'clearly seen' mean there is no cover at all?
'Clearly seen' is ambiguous between:

1) Must clearly be able to see the model.
2) Must be able to see the model clearly.

What the rules actually say is the former and it can be the case that you can clearly see the model even if it's still in some cover. But, that said, I'd agree with your opponent.

The point of hiding, as I understand it, is to simulate the way that real fighters would crouch, crawl, etc to make use of cover in ways that static (and often dynamically posed) models can't. As @Anthony says, there may be cases of partial cover that you can't reasonably hide behind, but so long as you remain behind a low wall or something, then I'd say he can stay hidden.
 
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Llewy

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I'm not sure it would be such a bad thing if it was restricted to being in cover though (i.e. partial cover would never be enough). Might make out-manoeuvring the enemy a more inviting tactic.
Fwiw, I agree with this sentiment @Anthony. My feeling is that the simplest solution is to make hiding only possible if the model is in full cover.

Whatever happens, definitely this is one of the essential things to get clarified one way or another before the next NCE update!
 
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