New edition 2020

Ben_S

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I doubt people are likely to want 8 re-rolls, but it is nice that if you get an extra re-roll (from cheering fans or something) with just a couple of turns left you're more likely to be able to use it.

Having seen a picture on FB, it looks like GW really screwed up some of the rules here though. It says that in the second half you replenish your used re-rolls, but don't get to carry unused ones over from the first half. So, if you start the game with 4 re-rolls and use 3 during the first half then - RAW - it seems you start the second half with 3.
 
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almic85

Cranky Git
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I doubt people are likely to want 8 re-rolls, but it is nice that if you get an extra re-roll (from cheering fans or something) with just a couple of turns left you're more likely to be able to use it.

Having seen a picture on FB, it looks like GW really screwed up some of the rules here though. It says that in the second half you replenish your used re-rolls, but don't get to carry unused ones over from the first half. So, if you start the game with 4 re-rolls and use 3 during the first half then - RAW - it seems you start the second half with 3.

I agree it’s poorly worded though the intent is quite clearly that you start each half with just the rerolls you have paid for, rather than the rerolls you have paid for plus any unused ones from the first half.

The reason why I think this is that directly after they say “... but unused team re-rolls do not carry over from the first half to the second half...” the follow it with the brackets “...(or from one fixture to the next in league play)”.

What’s silly is that they could have just replaced the word “game” with “half” in that entire paragraph and it would have read correctly without the need for the confusing last sentence.
 

Ben_S

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Yes, exactly - it would have been so easy for them to say what they (presumably) meant and yet they fail to do so. That's one reason why so many people doubt whether other changes, such as the new ability to use multiple re-rolls in a single turn, are intentional changes.
 

almic85

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One hundred percent agree. It’s one of those things that happens when they take a ruleset that has been interpreted the same way for 20 odd years and decide to reword it just because.

All it actually does is disguise any intended change behind a barrage of experienced coaches reading previous experience into the current rules.

To be honest it’s why I liked that the entire structure of the Necromunda game changed so much. It invalidated most of the arguments about how it was always done that way and just made them arguments over how it was actually worded.

Anyway it’s basically more stuff to send through to the FAQ email because unless the rules writers keep getting barraged with stupid questions they won’t understand that they aren’t being clear with their rules.
 
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Ben_S

Hive Lord
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I've more or less given up hope on that. They seem to think that the rules are perfect, it's just their players who can't read.
 

TopsyKretts

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Had a game night last night, it worked fine. We didn't read the rules too close and so didn't notice these kinds of details. We just assumed the most fundamental aspects were unchanged (like replenishing re-rolls).

Very skeptical about the new SPP (XP) system though. Looks like they imported the Necromunda system to Blood Bowl! :cry:😳😱

Sure, it can help against boring situations where you tend to take Block on (almost) everyone. But interested to see if the drawbacks are worth it. For example, need 18 SPP for a single stat advancement?
 

almic85

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The new advancement system is the thing that I want to see work in person as it’s a significant change. And yes it reeks of Necromunda.

My biggest issue is that it is exploitable and needs a level of intrinsic trust with your opponent that they didn’t fix the random rolls. It’s something that in Necromunda I can love with but in the ultra competitive land of bloodbowl I can see big issues with.
 

almic85

Cranky Git
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Less among friends and more among some of the ultra competitive leagues and tournaments that I have been a part of.

You know there was always that guy that happened to roll nothing but ballistic skill upgrades and select any skill on all his fighters.

I’m actually running a bloodbowl tournament in a February next year using the new rules and have had to change up the advancements to simplify them for ease of actually checking compliant rosters.

Basically the tier ratings get a set number of SPP’s (36/48/60) and can spend 6SPP on a selected primary and 12SPP on a selected secondary.

Anything harder than that for a competition tournament and my head will explode as a TO.

edit: I should also say that while bloodbowl always had random rolls they havenever costed the same skill on the same player differently depending on how they got it. This is more my issue as you now have to record if each skill was random or selected as it changes therelative cost of each player on the roster.

It’s basically more mandatory book keeping For everyone.
 

TopsyKretts

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Ahh yes, it was good when you could always backtrack costs and evolution of a team. The same advancement having different costs makes it more complicated and impossible to control yeah.
 

Ben_S

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I don't have the 2020 rules, but I assume the advancement system is designed for leagues. If you're running a one-off tournament, then I'd just ignore it. That's what tournaments have generally done in the past.
 

almic85

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I don't have the 2020 rules, but I assume the advancement system is designed for leagues. If you're running a one-off tournament, then I'd just ignore it. That's what tournaments have generally done in the past.

A lot of tournaments used to give out a limited number of normal and double rolls from the old advancement system depending on tier rating of the teams.

Some did completely different things like just give TV limits for tiers or all sorts of other ways of balancing teams.

The thing for TOs to be careful of though is that the new skills don’t cost the same as the old skills so the cost of inducements and even the use of secondary skill trees means that teams built under old tournament rules won’t be the same final TV as teams build under the same rules in the new system.
 

Ben_S

Hive Lord
Yak Comp 3rd Place
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Jul 26, 2015
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Southampton, UK
But that's kind of my point. Tournaments usually (at least in the past) just said 'you get X skills'. Sometimes, as you say, they would vary these according to team tier. As far as I'm aware, few if any actually used the normal inducement rules, so TV didn't matter.
 
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