N18 New enforcers theory hammer

TopsyKretts

Hive Guilder
Dec 29, 2017
2,054
1,723
138
Kristiansand
It's hard to tell with this stuff, since the editing is so spotty in N17, but here they literally chose NOT to copy and paste the base gang rules from every other gang for a reason. The best reason I can see is the Enforcer "gang" is a militia equipped by Helmawr in the same way the US army is equipped by the Pentagon - they have "Standard issue" gear provided by their employer.
The reason I see in these cases is they change random stuff for the sake of random.

Regardless, I agree. Keep it simple, Enforcers are a unique gang with unique restriction to their weaponry.
 
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alexflagg

Juve
Nov 3, 2016
10
21
13
Portland, OR
Sadly things like flare grenades, magnacles and possibly industrial resperators which mention enforcers specifically have opened up a bit of a Pandora's box for people. But then I always liked the house weapons lists...
Yeah, but this would probably have not been a problem if GW could just either a) be explicit with their intentions (e.g. "Enforcers cannot take the Trade action in the Post-Battle sequence" or "Enforcers cannot visit the Trading Post or Black Market") or b) put out a f**king errata for this game. I have no problem with the N17/18 House Weapon Lists, since they're way more expansive than those in the NRB and CRB, and I understand they don't want to have Enforcers rely upon ownership of the Book of Peril, but yikes did they rush through pretty basic stuff here.
 

Ml2sjw

Gang Hero
Nov 25, 2017
999
1,464
113
United kingdom
An errata/faq is long long overdue, that's for certain.

Anyway back on topic this is my current 1250 skirmish list. My enforcers are in stasis until FW reveal the look of the subjugators so I can work out if I want to but them or convert my own.


Obviously a very shooting based gang with a limited counter charge ability. I've found with my delaque and cawdor that the sheer reach of the long rifle is invaluable for locking areas of the board on SM though often regret having two when playing ZM.

This is a very heavy template gang that probably wants to engage at about the 12-24" inch bracket. On a campaign or larger games a few combat shotguns would go amiss and of course a shield equipped guy

What do you guys think?
 

Qrow.

Juve
Aug 30, 2019
19
6
3
Had two games today, first one was against goliath and was a simple beat em up style match so that people could learn the basic rules while watching. This was the list used in this match: https://yaktribe.games/underhive/gang/d-07092019-g3.67318/
I deployed in two squads, each with a champ, grenade launcher and concussion enforcer, with my leader joining the team with the trick shot champ.
Long story short, my leader took out three goliaths, one on a charge and the other two in reaction attacks, one of the concussion enforcers juggled two gangers and due to great rolling both were seriously injured. The goliath player bottled turn three and retreated his remaining gangers. Poor rolling on the goliaths part mainly won me this one, as he couldn't roll a single save roll amd failed way to many 3+ ro wound rolls against my leader.

Match two was a three way fight between goliath, escher and me. Same list, except we upped the points to the smallers players max points, so my leader had the SLHG and I took one standard enforcer with two stub guns and dum dum ammo as well. though the two gangs of despicable criminals decided to gang up on the enforcers and it became a very tough fight, again enforcers won out. Lessons learnt: concussion carbines are amazing at controlling the enemy, the LSHG is fantastic; even though it has a penalty for short range you will simply be charging if close enough, and providing constant barrages while moving or after combat was good at keeping the pressure on.
Having a subjugator with a shield and melee weapon is something I dont think I would play without, the pressure they apply is really good at making your other gangers seem less threatening.
 

Ml2sjw

Gang Hero
Nov 25, 2017
999
1,464
113
United kingdom
I like the idea of a subjugator shield guy but can see him spending a lot of time on his back pinned making their chances of getting into combat slim. Combat stims might be one way around this but still it's tricky
 

Glyn

Heckin Provost
Nov 27, 2017
293
401
133
London, UK
I like the idea of a subjugator shield guy but can see him spending a lot of time on his back pinned making their chances of getting into combat slim. Combat stims might be one way around this but still it's tricky
This is just one of the many reasons shock staves>batons.
 

Glyn

Heckin Provost
Nov 27, 2017
293
401
133
London, UK
Played my second game with enforcers tonight.

3 player free for all
Custom scenario, objective was to subdue and extract some wild Goliaths that had holed up in a pair of bunkers.

We played on SM this week. Lots of LOS breaking, lots of walk ways.
We only took in 800 points which for me meant my leader, and 4 patrolmen.

The Goliath and Delaque players ended up squaring off over one of the bunkers, with the Zerker doing most of the work for both of them. I was left mostly unharassed on bunker2. I say mostly because the Goliath AI was set up to shoot anything ending within 9” and Charge within 6” during the end phase (if they didn’t shoot).

After a few turns I assaulted the bunker and found the Goliaths to be quite a match, even with assistance. So often I would fail to wound, or fail to reaction wound. But as we piled on for some police brutality, the numbers started to stack up and we eventually overwhelmed them.

Which was when the Goliath player who had sneakily flanked, decided 5 enforcers was 4 too many, and dropped a smoke grenade to cover his “reverse tactical advance”.

Things that felt great about my Enforcers: tonight:
  • Shield+Staff Leader again. It’s just amazing especially when you pop stim slugs.
  • Dumdum pistols in melee are wonderul
  • Concussion Carbine got fires a couple of times and seismic was very satisfying.
Things I liked less:
  • Subjugator Grenade launchers just don’t do much for me yet. But in game one, I didn’t get to fire it, and in game 2 I was firing frags at T4 npcs.
  • I didn’t get to use my leaders skill... AGAIN!! Argh!
  • Concussion rifle range feels a little short.
Lots of fun overall



 
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Qrow.

Juve
Aug 30, 2019
19
6
3
Played my second game with enforcers tonight.

3 player free for all
Custom scenario, objective was to subdue and extract some wild Goliaths that had holed up in a pair of bunkers.

We played on SM this week. Lots of LOS breaking, lots of walk ways.
We only took in 800 points which for me meant my leader, and 4 patrolmen.

The Goliath and Delaque players ended up squaring off over one of the bunkers, with the Zerker doing most of the work for both of them. I was left mostly unharassed on bunker2. I say mostly because the Goliath AI was set up to shoot anything ending within 9” and Charge within 6” during the end phase (if they didn’t shoot).

After a few turns I assaulted the bunker and found the Goliaths to be quite a match, even with assistance. So often I would fail to wound, or fail to reaction wound. But as we piled on for some police brutality, the numbers started to stack up and we eventually overwhelmed them.

Which was when the Goliath player who had sneakily flanked, decided 5 enforcers was 4 too many, and dropped a smoke grenade to cover his “reverse tactical advance”.

Things that felt great about my Enforcers: tonight:
  • Shield+Staff Leader again. It’s just amazing especially when you pop stim slugs.
  • Dumdum pistols in melee are wonderul
  • Concussion Carbine got fires a couple of times and seismic was very satisfying.
Things I liked less:
  • Subjugator Grenade launchers just don’t do much for me yet. But in game one, I didn’t get to fire it, and in game 2 I was firing frags at T4 npcs.
  • I didn’t get to use my leaders skill... AGAIN!! Argh!
  • Concussion rifle range feels a little short.
Lots of fun overall



I have had the same thought about the subjugation grenade launchers, but I don't know how else to equip subjugator patrolmen with their limited weapon options. If the heavy concussion ram gets errata'd to have a 3" blast I would probably run that, but barring that maybe 2 stub guns, a shock stave and dum dum rounds?
 

Glyn

Heckin Provost
Nov 27, 2017
293
401
133
London, UK
I have had the same thought about the subjugation grenade launchers, but I don't know how else to equip subjugator patrolmen with their limited weapon options. If the heavy concussion ram gets errata'd to have a 3" blast I would probably run that, but barring that maybe 2 stub guns, a shock stave and dum dum rounds?
At this point I’m thinking I’d have been better off just buying them a shield each.
Then they’d be claiming the dual wield bonus dice when fighting, and they’d have +1/2 improved saves.
 

Glyn

Heckin Provost
Nov 27, 2017
293
401
133
London, UK
I didn’t have them modelled with shields though. Might have to give the nice Russians some more money.
 

Ml2sjw

Gang Hero
Nov 25, 2017
999
1,464
113
United kingdom
Experience with my other gangs (waiting for subjugators to be revealed) has shown that grenade launchers versitilty and a few extra grenade types are where things start to shine.

Being able to place smoke grenades within 24" rather than just 9 adds a lot of flexibility. A 10" wall of smoke is impressive to drop on the table to cover your advance/retreat or to refuse a flank during a firefight

Krack and Gas grenades are also useful for higher toughness guys.

All of this does represent extra expense though which in a low model count gang is less than ideal
 

Glyn

Heckin Provost
Nov 27, 2017
293
401
133
London, UK
Experience with my other gangs (waiting for subjugators to be revealed) has shown that grenade launchers versitilty and a few extra grenade types are where things start to shine.

Being able to place smoke grenades within 24" rather than just 9 adds a lot of flexibility. A 10" wall of smoke is impressive to drop on the table to cover your advance/retreat or to refuse a flank during a firefight

Krack and Gas grenades are also useful for higher toughness guys.

All of this does represent extra expense though which in a low model count gang is less than ideal
Yeah I'm hoping so. I got a +1 BS advancement on one of my subjugators, so I spent the 35 credits I'd built up to buy Kraks. (We don't have teritories in our campaign. We get a flat 15cr participation reward, and up to 30cr per game for objectives.)
 
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Srednak

Juve
Apr 13, 2019
20
4
13
Hi community

We are starting a dominion campaign with one player playing Enforcers. There are couple of questions about how they should work:

first is about term "scavenging" as in (p. 29 book of judgement): "during the course of campaign gang can may gain new equipment either by purchasing or as result of Scavenging". What does this refer to?

second is about conflict during takeover phase: (p. 30 book of judgement) "If challenged in the takeover phase, the ensuing battle will automatically take place within Palantine Precint.." This is fine, but under the Police Territory rules there is a mention of defending held territory: "Immediatly after taking control of the territory and every succesful defence of the territory". What do you think about this?

third is about lack of specialists. How does patrolman level up? Do they use ganger profile or specialist profile in advancements?

fourth question is about money. There are at least four ways they can get money that we have thought about: Their home territory (Palantine Precint), scenario based income, selling captured gangers and selling captured territories with Grant territory action. The fourth must be preplanned and negotiated if it happens during wrap-up and buyer is not present. Do anyone allready have campaing experince on is this enough money for the "gang" in long run?

Thank you in advance for your thoughts
 

Srednak

Juve
Apr 13, 2019
20
4
13
Scavenging is a future proofing thing. Possibly in the next book so don't worry about it for now.
Thanks. So no wonder I was baffled on that.

Also after going through the rules and such I think I have the answers to my second and third question. Second is just plain rules confusion as the excerpts clearly contradict each other. To my third question: patrolmen have skill acces lists so they are likely to level as specialists.

When it comes to ways to gain credits I might have missed some: so home territory boon is the obvious one, scenario based rewards is other, trading captives is third and trading territories is fourth. Is there any other ways to gain money in dominion campaign?
 

Glyn

Heckin Provost
Nov 27, 2017
293
401
133
London, UK
3rd game playing as Enforcers.

Custom scenario, basically KOTH but with two objectives.

Gangs:
  • Enforcers
  • Van Saar
  • Escher
We started at the table corners on a 3x5. The van sar was on the closest corner to me, so naturally we went at it, leaving the Escher unharassed. In the end, escher won based on a combo of a) everyone excep the escher leader, and my patrolman bottling, and b) The escher leader owning my last ganger.

Lots of good firepower exchanges. The Shield+Shock Staff really was MVP again.

We played on a table with a lot of verticality and a lot of narrow walkways... So for once - my concussion weapons really bashed people around. Lots of fall damage! But not a lot of fall related kills. So I dunno. Fun but not necessarily effective.

This was the first game I was able to use Threat Response / Got your six. So that was nice. It's very fun breaking activation sequence. But S3/T3 champs don't really deliver much of a punch, even with dum dums in their stubbys.

This was the last game in this act of the campaign I'm taking part in due to vacation. But when I get back, I'll be having a do-over of my gang and trying to fold in some of the experinces i've had to round them out a bit better.
 
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Qrow.

Juve
Aug 30, 2019
19
6
3
Couple of questions:
1. Historically, how long does forgeworld normally take to put out their weapon upgrade kits? I'm dying to see what subjugators look like.
2. How soon can we expect to see an FAQ regarding all the loose end in the book of judgement?
3. Is there any consensus on whether the heavy concussion ram is missing the blast (3/5") trait or is it just a flat out dud weapon? For 2.33x the cost of a regular concussion carbine, the slight range and strength increase does not seem worth it, especially when also losing the blast trait.
4. How are the enforcers working out in your local meta? My group seems to be really struggling against them, with one of the players flat our refusing to play against them.
 

Ml2sjw

Gang Hero
Nov 25, 2017
999
1,464
113
United kingdom
1. There is no real pattern delaque were a huge wait. From memory van Saar came out quite quickly.

2. See the sump with only one faq published so far when they released the hard back books I'm sadly not expecting anything any time soon.

3. No "proof" but most people seem to follow that line of thinking.

4. Only had a few games with enforcers as my arbitor forces. They seem to be pretty well balanced at the moment but then I'm not using subjugators at the moment....
 
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