N18 New player - Goliath campaign

GopherBeer

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May 7, 2024
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Hello All!

I’m a first-time player starting a new campaign and wanted to get some input on my Goliath gang list. It’s mostly stolen from Goonhammer but I added a few things. Sorry if the format is weird.



Forge Tyrant – Natborn, Prime Specimen & Tyrant’s Own (+1W, +1A, +1T) – furnace plates, combat shotgun, power axe – Skill: Nerves of Steel –

Stimmer – Vatborn, Dermal Hardening & Overdeveloped Musculature (+1T, +1S, -1Init) – furnace plates, paired spud-jackers – Skill: Nerves of Steel

Forge Boss – Unborn (shooting)– furnace plates, grenade launcher, smoke ammo, chain axe – Skill: Trick Shot–

Bruiser Specialist – Vatborn, Corrupted Slug (-1Ld, -1Int) – furnace plates, grenade launcher, smoke ammo

Bruiser – Vatborn, Nerve Burnout (-1Cl) – furnace plates, shotgun

Bully – Vatborn, Fearless but Foolish (+1Cl, -1Int) – furnace plates, fighting knife, stub gun, smoke grenade

Bully – Vatborn, corrupted slug, Terminal Biology (risk of death on Lasting Injury) – furnace plates, brute cleaver, stub gun



I have a few follow up questions:

Is 7 enough dudes or should I go for cheaper weapons and more fighters? I have the tactics card that lets me get 2 few Juves, I figured I would use that the first few fights.

Is the combat shot gun for the Tyrant a good choice? Maybe change for a bolter for longer range? Or just give him a regular shotgun and upgrade someone else?

Do I need 2 guys with grenade launchers?

Do I have enough smoke options? Or is it too much?

Should I hire a chem dealer early? Or a different hanger on?

Any advice or input would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!
 
7 fighters is ok for a starting Goliath gang. More bodies is always better but it's a little tricky with Goliaths. You could drop the chainaxe and power axe, good choices for later though, and squeeze in a extra body or maybe two.

For the vast majority of scenarios you don't get to choose which Gang tactics cards you get. It is typically a random draw from a shuffled deck. I would not plan in relying on a specific tactics cards. I believe the one you refer to is a general one. Your opponent can draw it.
If you play with tactics cards I would make plans for any of the ones in the deck but not rely on a single one.

Combat shotguns are great. So are bolters. Either will do the work on any fighter. Now looking at your tyrant. He has a 3+ BS value. It is not a waste to have a combat shotgun in him. However there is no difference in a 4+BS bruiser firing the template profile over the tyrant. (Although the tyrant will be more likely to get in range). It is still a good choice but not the best use of his higher ballistic skill. Personally I would pick the bolter out of the two options you give to make use of his higher BS.

Two grenade launchers are good (personally I would take different ones for variety but tactically two launchers are good). The krak rounds are punchy, the frag grenades have decent area effects for the price and the smoke grenade offer a good amount of directed smoke cover. Be wary of the 6+ Ammo rolls on the frag and krak grenades. They will trigger and fail a ammo roll a fair amount. Having the smoke grenades 4+ Ammo value does help you reload (if you make the 4+ roll, all ammo types are reloaded) but you will still spend some time Out of Ammo. Grenade launcher users are good candidates for, in the future, for a decent back up Sidearm. Boyles law will dictate that you fail a Ammo roll when a opponent is close. You could spend a action reloading or even two when it might be better to run away from that ravenous Corpse Grinder after giving them a parting shot with your back up bolt pistol.

Chem dealers are a bit of a double edges sword in my opinion when you usr all thier options.
The Fixer skill is great for a hanger on especially on one without the Part Of The Crew rule. Thier Steady Supply makes all Chems (and only Chems so not Frenzon Collars or Medical kits mind you) Common for normal Trade actions which is good if you go for chems.
Their other part of the Steady Supply rule allows you to add a Chem or item containing chems like Stimmer Slug stashes or Medical kits pre game. However you must pay for it after the battle or lose the dealer and not be able to hire another. If you lose a low income scenario and or have multiple Medical escort actions to pay for you can quickly find you have not got enough for the Chem loan and then you lose the Fixer skill, a great skill you don't have ready access to.
Personally I would take the Chem Dealer for the low price of 25 credits early. With the Fixer skill they can pay for themselves in a game or two and just earn money quietly. Occasionally take advantage of the Common Chems, like picking up some Stinger Mould, but not using thier other half of the Steady Supply rule at all.
 
The list is fine, 7 bodies with a Goliath starting gang is ok as your base Cool is solid enough that bottle checks are less of a big deal for you than other gangs.

Grenade launchers are solid, having two is strong, however if you're worried about being too strong initially or the list is feeling a little spammy for you trade one for a boltgun at the same price.

For your leaders weapon, I'd stick with the combat shotgun over the boltgun in this instance. The points Lunarcruiser makes above about a Tyrants BS and the value of the boltgun are all valid and true, however you've genesmithed your guy into a melee monster so I'd stick with the gun that encourages you to get close, heck id be half tempted to drop the shotgun for a pistol so you're never tempted to stand back taking shots at people when you should be charging.

If you want to free up some points, you could reconsider the chainaxe on your Forge Boss, as a grenade launcher guy he's more likely to be hanging back and shooting, so he's very unlikely to need it early on.
 
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I'd stick with the two grenade launchers.
It's far from game breaking but it should give you some good firepower. That's a good thing as a newbie, because you'll want some simple choices during a fight.

Some of the podcasts etc. out there are a bit overly zealous about what they consider "spam" or "broken" when it comes to lists. You'll often see people saying to only get one of a special weapon etc.

My take is that if the writers had wanted you to only use one of something then they would have made that a rule.

The same goes for the "boys before toys" rule of thumb that Goonhammer popularised. I just don't agree that you always need 10 dudes. Say the other player has 10 poorly equipped guys, and in round one you blow four of them away with your grenade launchers lol. So much for his superior action economy 😜
 
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The same goes for the "boys before toys" rule of thumb that Goonhammer popularised. I just don't agree that you always need 10 dudes. Say the other player has 10 poorly equipped guys, and in round one you blow four of them away with your grenade launchers lol. So much for his superior action economy 😜
Turn up with two grenade launchers and any opponent with a ounce of sense will not bunch up so out can't frag multiple fighters at once. Also it's a alternate activation system so you may get to fire the first grenade launcher but then your opponent makes thier action which should be shoot the other one to limit the other one.
Keeping the numbers up is not just about having more activations either.
It protects you from Bottling out.bthe more fighters you have on your starting crew the longer your gang keeps its bottle. Once your gang loses it's bottle in the vast majority of scenarios you lose a reputation point. For most you only gain one for winning. A lot of reputation leads to more hanger on or brute slots. I've seen a campaign where a player only managed to acrue 3 rep total with a 7 strong gang. While others had two Ambots and a ammo jack they were stuck with a vastly overworked rouge doc.
If you have 7 and your opponents had 10 on your starting crews you only need to lose two Bullies before being vulnerable to Bottle checks. Your opponent needs to lose 5. (Might be out by 1 of the top of my head but the point still stands). All your opponent has to do is take the two bullies out then, as most gangs are faster than you, run around hugging cover and staying out of sight untill you fail the bottle check. Then despite your decent Cool you will eventually fail Cool checks and you will lose more fighters.

Also the numbers game is vitally important to the post battle actions. If you have more people it lowers the chances of all your champions being critically injured or stuck in recovery. If your Gang Hierarchy fighters are all stuck in recovery they can't Trade or Medically Escort injured fighters.
If you have more bodies then the statistical likely hood of having such fighters unavailable drops so you can Trade or just keep people on the field. Being constantly outnumbered hurts regardless of how good your smaller gang is. Weight of numbers is a real thing.
 
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This is great input, thanks all!

I actually didn't know that the 4+ ammo roll for the smoke reloaded all the grenade types! Do we know what page that rule is on? I have a feeling the other guys will ask :)

A big part of why I wanted the grenade launchers for the Krak ammo option. One of the guys playing Delaque has 4+ armor on his Nacht-Ghuls and I want a way to drop them before they slice my face off! But now I'm thinking I should change one for a bolter (probably the boss?) and give the Tyrant a stub/plasma pistol. Both of those have a little AP on them. I'm a little worried about the ammo rolls for them though, especially the plasma since it's "scarce". How often do ammo rolls come up?

If I drop the chain axe and the extra smoke ammo, I can get another Juve or Forge born with a stub gun or something. Does anyone take Forge Born? I know they kinda suck at the start, but don't they get promoted to Champions eventually?
 
Turn up with two grenade launchers and any opponent with a ounce of sense will not bunch up so out can't frag multiple fighters at once. Also it's a alternate activation system so you may get to fire the first grenade launcher but then your opponent makes thier action which should be shoot the other one to limit the other one.
Keeping the numbers up is not just about having more activations either.
It protects you from Bottling out.bthe more fighters you have on your starting crew the longer your gang keeps its bottle. Once your gang loses it's bottle in the vast majority of scenarios you lose a reputation point. For most you only gain one for winning. A lot of reputation leads to more hanger on or brute slots. I've seen a campaign where a player only managed to acrue 3 rep total with a 7 strong gang. While others had two Ambots and a ammo jack they were stuck with a vastly overworked rouge doc.
If you have 7 and your opponents had 10 on your starting crews you only need to lose two Bullies before being vulnerable to Bottle checks. Your opponent needs to lose 5. (Might be out by 1 of the top of my head but the point still stands). All your opponent has to do is take the two bullies out then, as most gangs are faster than you, run around hugging cover and staying out of sight untill you fail the bottle check. Then despite your decent Cool you will eventually fail Cool checks and you will lose more fighters.

Also the numbers game is vitally important to the post battle actions. If you have more people it lowers the chances of all your champions being critically injured or stuck in recovery. If your Gang Hierarchy fighters are all stuck in recovery they can't Trade or Medically Escort injured fighters.
If you have more bodies then the statistical likely hood of having such fighters unavailable drops so you can Trade or just keep people on the field. Being constantly outnumbered hurts regardless of how good your smaller gang is. Weight of numbers is a real thing.
Some good points, and I'm not saying there isn't some wisdom to larger crew sizes - particularly the bottle check example. I just think it's sort of become dogma.

You've prompted me to think about it a bit more deeply and I think the issue is more that the advice of having more bodies seems to be conflated with the idea that all those bodies should have gear spread relatively evenly. This leads to bland gangs.

Don't want to derail the thread though!
 
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What about something like this?

Looks pretty good! You could consider a hand flamer in there somewhere if you're worried about Nacht Ghuls. You need to be a bit closer to get them, but you're garaunteed a hit, and there's a good chance they'll catch fire. That's helpful because often NGs have spring up, so pinning them isn't enough. A proto goliath might be a good choice for a ganger with a flamer, for the extra movement and credits saved.
 
How often do ammo rolls come up?

If I drop the chain axe and the extra smoke ammo, I can get another Juve or Forge born with a stub gun or something. Does anyone take Forge Born? I know they kinda suck at the start, but don't they get promoted to Champions eventually?
Ammo rolls are a 1 in 6 chance for every shot taken, the pistol for your Forge Boss should ideally be getting used in melee for the bonus attack, with the general smithing and gear you've given him you should be double moving or charging for the most part, not taking pot shots with a pistol so I wouldn't sweat it too much.

Forge Born have the advantage of being faster than other Goliath, so are good for objectives / crates etc. never hurts to have one in the lineup
 
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