N18 Outcast gangs with House Affiliation

Masa13

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Mar 19, 2020
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In the Book of Outcasts in the section on Leader affiliations, it says that
Clan House Underhive Outcasts gangs may purchase weapons and Wargear normally restricted to their House Lists – including Exotic Beasts – during both gang creation and Campaign play.
What does this mean in practice? If I pick House Goliath as affiliation, can a Scum Ganger buy items from any of the House Weapon lists, only from the Gang Fighter ones (Specialist Juve, Ganger/Specialist, Juve), or only from the Ganger/Specialist list? Can Outcast champions buy equipment from the House of X specialist champion item lists? Can the Leader buy items from the specialist Champion lists?
 

Squee

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If I pick House Goliath as affiliation, can a Scum Ganger buy items from any of the House Weapon lists, only from the Gang Fighter ones (Specialist Juve, Ganger/Specialist, Juve), or only from the Ganger/Specialist list? Can Outcast champions buy equipment from the House of X specialist champion item lists? Can the Leader buy items from the specialist Champion lists?

ATM this is entirely unclear.
So sadly the only answer here is whatever your Arbiter decides.
 

Masa13

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Mar 19, 2020
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Wouldn't it be so simple as Outcast Leader has access to Goliath Leader equipment, Outcast Champ got Goliath Champ equipment and Outcast Ganger got Goliath Ganger equipment?
I think that's the way I'm reading it too, I just wondered about things like the Arc hammer in the Orlock Arms Master profile or the Paired weapons on the Goliath Stimmer profile.
 

Masa13

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Mar 19, 2020
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And to add to this thought, does becoming a Outcast Gang Leader remove things like Weapon restrictions from elevated profiles? So if you picked the Orlock Arms master as a base you wouldn't be restricted from Special or Heavy weapons, or with a Slave Ogryn Overboss profile you could now use any weapons from the Trading Post freely?
 

TopsyKretts

Hive Lord
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Dec 29, 2017
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I mean, they do still have weapon type restrictions so that's never gonna happen regardless. This is more a matter of if they can have the assault grenade launchers at all and who can have phelynx cats (if any).
 
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Squee

Gang Champion
Jan 11, 2019
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Wouldn't it be so simple as Outcast Leader has access to Goliath Leader equipment, Outcast Champ got Goliath Champ equipment and Outcast Ganger got Goliath Ganger equipment?
There are arguments to do it in other ways, actually.
Say you'd like to use your Arms Master with Arc-Hammer or your Archeotek with Spider Rig mini as your Outcast Leader for narrative reasons. By the above ruling you won't be able to do that, since those weapons are only available to respective Champions, but not the leaders in the same gangs.
 

libratorr

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Sep 16, 2017
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There are arguments to do it in other ways, actually.
Say you'd like to use your Arms Master with Arc-Hammer or your Archeotek with Spider Rig mini as your Outcast Leader for narrative reasons. By the above ruling you won't be able to do that, since those weapons are only available to respective Champions, but not the leaders in the same gangs.
To say nothing of Outcast Orlocks using Wrecker weapons without the jump packs.
Which don't appear to be priced separately anywhere...(feels like something that should be added to a second edition of House of Iron).

Meanwhile the previously very average Escher Wyld Runner weapons that were previously restricted to BS 5 and S 2 fighters are much more deadly fitted to Outcast gangers of cheaper cost!
 

Squee

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To say nothing of Outcast Orlocks using Wrecker weapons without the jump packs.
Which don't appear to be priced separately anywhere...(feels like something that should be added to a second edition of House of Iron).

Meanwhile the previously very average Escher Wyld Runner weapons that were previously restricted to BS 5 and S 2 fighters are much more deadly fitted to Outcast gangers of cheaper cost!
Wait, there are Wrecker-specific weapons?

As for the Wyld Runner weapons, it's also unclear if they can be used under this system, as the Outcast gang doesn't have Prospects (or Juves for that matter).

So the point is that directly connecting House equipment lists to fighter types doesn't provide adequate results at least in some scenarios. I would argue that those are not fringe cases.
 

libratorr

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Sep 16, 2017
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Wait, there are Wrecker-specific weapons?

As for the Wyld Runner weapons, it's also unclear if they can be used under this system, as the Outcast gang doesn't have Prospects (or Juves for that matter).

So the point is that directly connecting House equipment lists to fighter types doesn't provide adequate results at least in some scenarios. I would argue that those are not fringe cases.
Not sure about Wrecker-specific weapons.
BotO at page 14:”The Underhive Outcasts gang does not contain any Juves; whenever a rule refers to a Juve it instead affects an Underhive Outcasts Hive Scum.”
So possibly scope for Juve-specific gear list being open for Hive Scum to use, but Prospects are several jumps down the slippery slope.
Fluff-wise I can’t see Hive Scum having Prospect gear based on the notion that they’re mostly hazing ritual items given to fighters too weak to be a regular ganger.
 

TopsyKretts

Hive Lord
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I don't buy any fluff reasons making restrictions. Because you can have a gang lead by a sump kroc! I don't see any restrictions for a wrecker to be outcast leader. The question isn't if outcast leader can have surf or have jump pack, but what the equipment list will be.

The affiliation applies to the gang, not anything unique or particular to the leader. So if the leader is made using orlock wrecker, the leader fighter will have jump pack. But the equipment sets of the gang will be as Goliath. So then you have a wrecker leader with Krumper rivet cannon.