Rak'gol razor gun confusion

[HugeSamples]

do note that Toxin weapons become a lot more interesting in an Escher gang, due to they ways they can enhance them.

Although this gun--Rak'gol Razer Gun--is probably Essoteric, so I don't think they can use their chem alchemy on it.

 

[quindraco]

How does that gun work exactly. Is it just rapid fire needle gun? Rak'gol razor gun has normal gun profile except is lacks strenght. I guess it just rolls on toxic trait instead on wound but why give it -2 ap and 1 dmg. How do you inflict normal dmg with this gun if you doens't know what STR is the shot.

First of all, the Rak'gol Razor Gun has a mangled profile; D1 does not make any sense for it and your arbitrator needs to fix it. It has to be D-, due to how Toxin works.

So you do this:

1. Roll a hit die and 1-2 firepower dice (you choose 1 or 2).
2. If you hit, you hit a number of times equal to the pips shown on all FP dice you rolled.
3. Do any ammo tests you need to make (you will need to make 0-2 ammo tests, depending on how many are showing). 1 failure empties the gun, 2 failures breaks it for the rest of the battle.
4. Resolve each hit, one at a time, using the Toxin rules:
   1. Roll target's T or higher, or a nat 6, to wound.
   2. Opponent rolls armour save.
   3. Go straight to injury, Toxin weapons do not use the damage mechanic (which is why D1 is a rules paradox for this gun).

 

[Sosari12]

You're thinking too hard .

Ye true xd was getting late and got a but carried away, sorry

 

[TopsyKretts]

Rak'gol originates from N19 Judgement. It was the worst year of Necromunda rules quality, full of mistakes. It's the only gun in the entire game with Toxin and Damage stat. Never been reprinted since? Obvious mistake.

Already reported here: https://yaktribe.games/community/threads/collected-errors-typos-in-the-book-of-judgement.9166/
Funny, seems like the FAQ has already fixed this once, but only half way, removing the Strength stat. Classic GW.

 

[quindraco]

Rak'gol originates from N19 Judgement. It was the worst year of Necromunda rules quality, full of mistakes. It's the only gun in the entire game with Toxin and Damage stat. Never been reprinted since? Obvious mistake.

Already reported here: https://yaktribe.games/community/threads/collected-errors-typos-in-the-book-of-judgement.9166/
Funny, seems like the FAQ has already fixed this once, but only half way, removing the Strength stat. Classic GW.

Gunk Bombs are worse, at least with the RRG it's easy to ignore a bogus S if present. With the Gunk Bomb, it could plausibly need its S removed or a D added.

 

[SirWalterManny]

Spire of Primus (p78)

Chymist Cult Toxin Gardens: Battle Effects “In a battle where this Spire District is the stake, weapons with the Toxin trait increase their Damage characteristic by 1”

So, what does this mean?

1. GW Error - and has no effect as weapons with Toxin trait bypass any wound roll, going straight to injury roll (after save roll) and do not cause damage.
2. Confirmation that if a weapon has Toxin Trait AND a damage characteristic, it also causes damage (removing wounds and potentially triggering an addition non-toxin injury roll)?

From what I can see, only the Rak’gol Razor Gun currently has the Toxin trait AND a damage characteristic (of 1).

But now with this Spire District Territory, it would have a Damage characteristic of 2. And others (following) would now have a Damage of 1:

• Throwing Knives
• Wyld Bow Poison Arrows
• Needle Pistol
• Flechette Pistol Fleshbane ammo
• Needle Rifle
• Stiletto Knife
• Stiletto Sword
• Desire’s Needle
• Barbed Flabellum
• Haemophagic Blade
• Venom Claw

 

[SirWalterManny]

Spire of Primus (p78)

Chymist Cult Toxin Gardens: Battle Effects “In a battle where this Spire District is the stake, weapons with the Toxin trait increase their Damage characteristic by 1”

So, what does this mean?

1. GW Error - and has no effect as weapons with Toxin trait bypass any wound roll, going straight to injury roll (after save roll) and do not cause damage.
2. Confirmation that if a weapon has Toxin Trait AND a damage characteristic, it also causes damage (removing wounds and potentially triggering an addition non-toxin injury roll)?

From what I can see, only the Rak’gol Razor Gun currently has the Toxin trait AND a damage characteristic (of 1).

But now with this Spire District Territory, it would have a Damage characteristic of 2. And others (following) would now have a Damage of 1:

• Throwing Knives
• Wyld Bow Poison Arrows
• Needle Pistol
• Flechette Pistol Fleshbane ammo
• Needle Rifle
• Stiletto Knife
• Stiletto Sword
• Desire’s Needle
• Barbed Flabellum
• Haemophagic Blade
• Venom Claw

I’m for option 1 (GW error … new collected errors post for @TopsyKretts )

Otherwise how is it determined if damage caused?

Most have no STR value.

So would it be automatic (if save roll failed)? Automatic if toxin had successfully already caused an injury roll? Both seem very strong.

 

[PalatineKatinka]

Spire of Primus (p78)

Chymist Cult Toxin Gardens: Battle Effects “In a battle where this Spire District is the stake, weapons with the Toxin trait increase their Damage characteristic by 1”

So, what does this mean?

1. GW Error - and has no effect as weapons with Toxin trait bypass any wound roll, going straight to injury roll (after save roll) and do not cause damage.
2. Confirmation that if a weapon has Toxin Trait AND a damage characteristic, it also causes damage (removing wounds and potentially triggering an addition non-toxin injury roll)?

Perhaps 3. Roll an extra Injury die when rolling for Injury with Toxin weapons. (If the writers forgot that Toxin weapons are Damage '-' and thought bumping them all from 1 to 2 would mean rolling 2 Injury Dice instead of the normal 1.)

Probably worth bringing the FAQ's answer on Desire's Needle into the conversation for what they've said before about a Toxin/Power combo giving +1 Damage to '-'.

Q. Why does the Desire’s Needle have the Power trait; the Power trait increases the Damage of the weapon by 1 on a natural 6 but a Toxin weapon doesn’t do damage. Is that intentional?

A. The inclusion of the Power trait is intentional. The extra damage is not the only effect of the trait in question - it also means that attacks made with Desire’s Needle cannot be Parried and, on a natural 6, no save roll can be made against the weapon.

 

[SirWalterManny]

Perhaps 3. Roll an extra Injury die when rolling for Injury with Toxin weapons. (If the writers forgot that Toxin weapons are Damage '-' and thought bumping them all from 1 to 2 would mean rolling 2 Injury Dice instead of the normal 1.)

Probably worth bringing the FAQ's answer on Desire's Needle into the conversation for what they've said before about a Toxin/Power combo giving +1 Damage to '-'.

---

Yes, that would be a good option (rolling extra injury dice). If that was intended (which agree would make sense) would need clarification as to if the Rak’Gol Razor Gun was intended to have a damage of ‘-‘, or a damage of 1 higher than other Toxin weapons (e.g. do the Chymist Cult Toxin Gardens now mean all toxin weapons result in two injury dice being rolled for each successful toxin hit… or is the Rak’Gol Razor gun supposed to inflict one more than other current weapons).

 

[Vonvilkee]

---

Yes, that would be a good option (rolling extra injury dice). If that was intended (which agree would make sense) would need clarification as to if the Rak’Gol Razor Gun was intended to have a damage of ‘-‘, or a damage of 1 higher than other Toxin weapons (e.g. do the Chymist Cult Toxin Gardens now mean all toxin weapons result in two injury dice being rolled for each successful toxin hit… or is the Rak’Gol Razor gun supposed to inflict one more than other current weapons).

Or does it remove a wound in addition to the injury roll? There by depending on number of wounds result in multiple injury dice...

 

[TopsyKretts]

Rak'gol is an obvious mistake if I ever saw one. It should for all intents and purposes be Damage '-'.

 

[Hobo86]

rapid fire & toxin... you can have multiple injury rolls bypassing wounds
considering flesh wounds exists it's not that odd?

damage 1 in this case limits the number of injury rolls (or to clarify that)

 

[HugeSamples]

I'm not sure where you guys are getting damage 1 from on the Rak'gol Razor Gun. I'm looking at the Core Rulebook and it has a - for both Strength and Damage as expected for a toxin weapon (page 263).

 

[Hobo86]

necroraw has it, checking book of judgement and faq now...

edit: @HugeSamples it comes from the book of judgement / necroraw

 

[Aulenback]

necroraw has it, checking book of judgement and faq now...

edit: @HugeSamples it comes from the book of judgement / necroraw

And is, of course, NOT mentioned in the FAQ errata for BoJudgement, despite being “fixed” in N23 Core Rule Book, so obviously needing errata. And despite other weapon profiles in BoJ getting errata in the FAQ.

Sigh.