Rules questions

pauman

Ganger
Sep 5, 2016
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movement:

1) can you charge without seeing the target?
(I think yes, and I think target model cannot fire overwatch but is able to retreat)

shooting:

1) can you fire a pistol in close combat if you just charged?
(I think you cannot)

2) can a flyer shoot after retrat?
(page 23 says yes, but page 28 does not list it)
 
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Thorgor

Of The YAQ
Oct 12, 2015
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Movement:
  1. I'm pretty sure you are correct on all accounts. The rules for charging simply state that the target(s) must be within 12" of the model (as defined on p16, no LoS involved). The rules for Overwatch (p31) specifically remind that 'the target must be in range and visible when they declare the charge', but Retreat doesn't have that limitation.

Shooting:
  1. No. The rules for Pistols let you ignore the minimum 1" range rule but that's it. They don't let you ignore the other rules from the '1. Choose a Model to Shoot With' step (p28) that state a model that has made a charge attempt, Advanced, Fallen Back or Retreated cannot shoot this turn

  2. Since Falling back and Retreat use the same 'Fall back' token as I reminder, I think the intent is that they should be treated the same and I'd go by p23 over p28.
 
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pauman

Ganger
Sep 5, 2016
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I am not sure if I understand the "inflict damage" section on page 31.

first example:
I shoot a fusion rifle, and I cause 6 damages to a model with 3 wounds, so I roll 6d6 to take it ooa at 4+, right?

second example:
I shoot something that shoots 2 times.
If everything suceeds, first injury roll is 1d6 and ooa 4+, and second injury roll is 1d6 ooa at 3+, right?

third example:
I shoot my rail file at short range (2 shots).
First one: I hit, I wound with a 6, so mortal wound, then injury roll (1d6 ooa 4+), I also inflict 3 damages, so (3d6 ooa 3+)?
Second one: I hit, I wound with a 6, so mortal wound, then injury roll (1d6 ooa 2+), I also inflict 3 damages, so (3d6 ooa 1+)?



It is not clear which are shaken effects:
p36: "cannot do anything."
does this mean, you cannot move, shoot, react, deny psykic powers? nothing?

I think it will be easy to get the full team broken, because every model adds a +1 when breaking the others.
 

Thorgor

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I shoot a fusion rifle, and I cause 6 damages to a model with 3 wounds, so I roll 6d6 to take it ooa at 4+, right?
Yes. Technically, you roll 6D6 and only keep the maximum result among them and apply its effect. This is important if you are playing against Necrons, since their Reanimation protocol triggers on a 6 (so if you roll 1, 3, 3, 4, 5, 6 you can't choose the 5 to kill them but must keep the 6 to save them)

I shoot something that shoots 2 times.
If everything suceeds, first injury roll is 1d6 and ooa 4+, and second injury roll is 1d6 ooa at 3+, right?
No, the second hit is discarded and does nothing: 'If a model’s wounds are reduced to 0, any further attacks against this model by the attacking weapon are not resolved'. This means you should always spread your shots among available targets whenever possible.
Note that this applies only when you shoot a weapon with multiple attacks, not when you shoot two weapons in succession.

I shoot my rail file at short range (2 shots).
First one: I hit, I wound with a 6, so mortal wound, then injury roll (1d6 ooa 4+), I also inflict 3 damages, so (3d6 ooa 3+)?
Second one: I hit, I wound with a 6, so mortal wound, then injury roll (1d6 ooa 2+), I also inflict 3 damages, so (3d6 ooa 1+)?
No. Assuming all shots target the same model and everything wounds, you only roll for the D3 attack (so 3D6, keep the max, apply effect), everything else is discarded ('If a model loses its last wound when there are attacks or mortal wounds (see opposite) still allocated to it, these are not resolved.'). The mortal wound is only used if the attack fails to pierce the target's armour or if the target is a Lictor with its 4 Wounds left.
Note: I wonder if you can choose to resolve the mortal wound first. It would be relevant in the Lictor's case, as you could get to toll 3D6 for the Injury roll instead of 1D6

It is not clear which are shaken effects:
p36: "cannot do anything."
does this mean, you cannot move, shoot, react, deny psykic powers? nothing?
Yes, the model cannot do anything. Passive effects (Voix caster, Icons...) may continue to apply though, but some of them have a 'as long as this model is not shaken' limitation (like Leader abilities or the Enhanced Data-tether).
I'm not 100% positive for the Deny the witch test, but it does look like something that would require the model not to be shaken.

I think it will be easy to get the full team broken, because every model adds a +1 when breaking the others.
Yes, it's a very real threat for horde teams, especially the ones with low Leadership like Orks or Astra Militarum. Comms specialists can help (thanks to the Rousing Transmission tactic) as can Medic specialists to a lesser extent. Some gear/abilities/tactics can also help, like the Vox caster for AM or their Reserves of courage tactic, Synapse from the Tyranid warrior, Bonding Knife Ritual for the T'au... yeah, my Gretchin team is gonna suffer from this....
On the other hand, some factions are pretty much unaffected by nerve tests, like all flavours of Loyalist marines (Leadership 7 And They Shall Know No Fear) and Necron (Leadership 10 and Reanimation protocol discards flesh wounds)
 
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pauman

Ganger
Sep 5, 2016
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a simple one:

genestealer cult can only include 1 genestealer purestrain, right?

and deathwatch only 1 reiver OR 1 intercessor, right?
 

Thorgor

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genestealer cult can only include 1 genestealer purestrain, right?

and deathwatch only 1 reiver OR 1 intercessor, right?
I don't think they are limited at all (well, except for the usual things like no more than 2 intercessor gunners in a Kill Team, only 1 sergeant, etc.)
The Fortis Kill Team and Purestrain genestealers rules let you change the faction keyword of any primaris or genestealer you add to your command roster, and the only limitation to that is you can't have more than 20 models on your roster.
 
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Ben_S

Hive Guilder
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Yeah, I don't think I've seen anyone take this 0-1 interpretation.

Is there some reason for thinking that is the case? If so, I'm open to persuasion, but it hadn't occurred to me that there was any such limit beyond those always in place.
 

pauman

Ganger
Sep 5, 2016
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I have read it again. There is no limit. I thought it said "can take a reiver or intercessor".
 
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pauman

Ganger
Sep 5, 2016
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1) Question about nurgle

Disgustingly Resilient: Each time a model with this ability loses a wound, roll a D6; on a 5+ the model does not lose that wound.
if a plague marine gets wounded by something with more than 1 damage, 5+ roll is rolled for the wound and then apply X damages? or it is rolled as many times as damage causes the weapon?

2) questions about tau drones intercepting wounds

Saviour Protocols: If a DRONE is within 3" of a friendly T’AU EMPIRE INFANTRY model when an enemy attack successfully wounds it, you can inflict a mortal wound on the Drone, and the target model does not suffer any damage from this attack.
2.1) if tau is wounded by a multiwound weapon (krak missile), do the drone receive only 1 mortal wound instead of 1D6?

2.2) if tau gets shot 2 times by a full power plasma at short range, I inflict 1 mortal wound to the drone, I roll injury (only flesh wound for the drone). Can I also inflict 1 mortal wound to the drone for the second shot? do the drone have to roll injury again (same plasma weapon)?
 

pressure

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Aug 19, 2017
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As for the damage question earlier, we came with an issue with blight launchers, 2 shots, 2 hits then 2 wounds. Then d3 damage.

They way I interpret it was you would need to do this 1 at a time, for example if the 1st 2d3 was a 2, you could remove 2 wounds then have 2 injury rolls, and the second hit is ignored. I’m not sure if this is correct entirely
 

dabbk

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I think you roll for each wound loss, then whatever attack that took you to 0, you roll for damage what this dmg was. So, 3 hits with d3 dmg weapon against 1w model, saves failed. D3 gets 1, 3, 2. roll 5+ for first: succeed. roll then 5 (succeed), 6(again success, lucky rolls!) but fail last one: 1w is taken, target gets to 0w. 3rd attack with dmg 2 is ignored, but you roll 3 dice for injury (and keep highest only) : attack that took last wound was dmg3.
 

Thorgor

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I agree. With Disgustingly Resilient you roll for each Wound lost, which should be the same as rolling for each damage taken. Only discard remaining allocated hits when Disgustingly Resilient fails to protect your last Wound.

For Saviour Protocol, you can convert any wounding hit to a Mortal Wound for the Drone. The Damage characteristics of the attack doesn't matter, the Drone only takes a single Mortal Wound (so it's better used on D2+ attacks). Apply separately for each hit.

I wonder if Saviour Protocol can protect you from Mortal wounds caused by a Sniper rifle (when a 6 is rolled). Is it part of the attack?