N18 Selling your juves...

rippounet

Ganger
Apr 29, 2016
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Quick question: can I sell a juve that I got for free (through a colony or house favor) ?

I would swear I saw the rule for this *somewhere* but can't find it again.
Did I imagine it or is it well hidden in one of those books?
 

enyoss

Gang Hero
Tribe Council
Jul 19, 2015
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There is a special event where you can do this I think, but that’s it. It’s not a normal part of the game.
 

Thorgor

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Oct 12, 2015
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There is a Territory (Corpse Farm — RB p101) that gives you money for any fighter that leaves your or your opponent's gang.
It's (obviously) intended for recycling the corpses of dead fighters, but technically RAW it also works for retired fighters, which lets you hire and fire juves for a profit (also note that you get to keep (and sell) the equipment of retired fighters)

Regardless, a Juve is a Juve regardless of how they're acquired. So they would follow all the normal rules for Juves.
Careful with that line of thinking, it's way too logical for N18! :ROFLMAO:
For instance, we know that the free armour most fighters get when they are hired is not treated the same as identical armour purchased from the HWL or TP.
 
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Thorgor

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Do we know free armour is not treated the same?
There's a disagreement on how that armour is treated.
That's one of those things that has been semi-officially FAQed by one of the devs on social media (I can't remember if it was JTY or Andy Hoare). There was a thread about it somewhere on the forum, I'll try to fetch it.
For the record, I strongly disagree with that ruling as I find it completely illogical. As you said <stuff> is <stuff> regardless of how it has been obtained.

Edit: in fact, it was an answer to an email sent to the FAQ address, not a random post on FB. Here is the thread where it was quoted.
 
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I wonder how long we'll have to wait to get an actual FAQ. It's ridiculous to expect us to be up to date on the Dev's latest social media messages or emails

Although I also disagree with the ruling, it is a simple ruling that makes sense.
It means your base fighter is a set value, so you don't have to reduce their cost when changing their gear.
Your rating is always fighter+gear, and the default armour is a part of the fighter.

It certainly makes more sense than Yaktribe's way of doing things, in which the fighters default armour gets a value of 0cr.
 

Thorgor

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I wonder how long we'll have to wait to get an actual FAQ
At this point, I'm not confident we'll get one. Let's hope they will do an update a few months after the Perils of the Underhive (or whatever its name ends up being) book is released to tackle the new issues this book will inevitably create, and they will use the opportunity to fix older issues.

There are only two ways to manage free starting armour that would make sense to me:
  • The armour is treated as armour you'd get as a trade for releasing a prisoner: it doesn't have an acquisition cost but does contribute to gang rating if equipped to a fighter (i.e. for 55 credits you get a 55gr Orlock ganger plus a 15gr Mesh armour, for a total of 70gr)
  • The armour is actually not free, you are just forced to purchase it alongside the fighter (i.e. for 55 credits you don't get a 55gr Orlock ganger with free Mesh armour, but you get a 40gr Orlock ganger and a 15gr Mesh armour)
Anything else involves some items (fighter/equipment) having a different gang rating depending on how they are currently equipped or how they were obtained, which is heresy.
 
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I agree, it gets weird when you remove the mesh armour and out it back. But that's a pretty unlikely case.

Personally, I like the idea that get a 40cr Orlock and 15cr mesh, but Under the logic behind the Devs system.

I really, really hope they don't continue their previous practice of instead of giving us an FAQ, they just sell us a new book that repeats half the rules with slight tweaks.
It's taking the piss.
 
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Thorgor

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I really, really hope they don't continue their previous practice of instead of giving us an FAQ, they just sell us a new book that repeats half the rules with slight tweaks.
It's taking the piss.
From what we have heard so far, this shouldn't be the case, at least not with the upcoming Perils book. It will have updated Venator rules to overwrite the previous one, but those needed an update for N18 anyway, and everything else in the book will apparently be brand new (which doesn't mean there won't be any problem with it of course).
 
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rippounet

Ganger
Apr 29, 2016
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Ok, thanks.

But can I at least get rid of that juve I don't want? I.e. can you still retire any fighter at any time?
 

Thorgor

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But can I at least get rid of that juve I don't want? I.e. can you still retire any fighter at any time?
You can retire any fighter but not at any time. It can only happen during step 6.A of the post-battle sequence (after post-battle actions have been performed but before the gang visits the trading post, so you can sell or reuse the equipment of retired fighters right away)
As Kiro said, and until we get a silly ruling that states something else, a Juve obtained for free should not be treated differently than any other Juve, so you should be able to fire them if you wish to.

Note that you are not forced to recruit the free juve in the first place if you don't want to (Settlement states that you "may" recruit a Juve for free, so it's legal to roll (hoping for a free ganger on a double 6) and refuse to hire the free Juve if you get a single 6)
 
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rippounet

Ganger
Apr 29, 2016
170
228
48
Paris
Note that you are not forced to recruit the free juve in the first place if you don't want to (Settlement states that you "may" recruit a Juve for free, so it's legal to roll (hoping for a free ganger on a double 6) and refuse to hire the free Juve if you get a single 6)
Great, thanks!
 
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There is also a campaign event in GW3 called juve harvest where at the beginning of the cycle you can sell them. There is a -5 credit penalty for every serious injury they get. Not particularly convenient for the situation though.
As for the armor argument, I don't believe you were allowed to sell the knife fighters came with in old 'munda and I'd apply the same logic. Can't get something for nothing in the underhive!