Spyrers for N17 WIP

Loriel

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Nov 27, 2013
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Spyrers for N17

VAULT LINK: https://yaktribe.games/community/vault/n17-spyrers.955/

Introduction:
First I started a project for Spyrers on my own, but @Graushwein and @Ikiry0 suggested that we would team up to make these rules better.

Hopefully we can come up with decent rules that capture the essence of Spyrers and allow them to be used nicely with the N17 ruleset.

Desing Principles
  • High Tech Elite Force -> Small Gang with numerous gadgets
  • Powerfull items and weaponry, cowardly user
Gangwide Special Rules

  • Permantently "Outlawed"
    • Technically I haven't done any "outlaw" rules yet, but people perhaps get the point :D
  • We don't need bottle caps: Spyrers are sons and daughters of the Noble Houses that rule Hive Primus. They are stupendously rich and don’t have any need for scraps nor do business with traders in the underhive.
    • Spyrers has no territory
    • Spyrers don't collect income nor use credits
    • Spyrers don't use trading post in anyway
    • Spyrers dont' starve
    • They don't use any hired guns or hangerson
  • Independent: Spyrers are highly self-motivated and tend to rival against each other. They seldom follow anyone leadership or use team work to achieve their goals.
    • Spyrers don't have Leader. They don't receive any leader bonuses etc. Any leadership test normally taken by leader will be made with Spyrer of the players choosing.
    • Spyrers never attemp to rescue their teammates and they will never pay anykind of ransoms whatsoever. Captured Spyrer cannot be sold to slavery but they are instead always killed and their devices can be sold for 3d6x5 credits. Spyrer Equiptment cannot be used by anyone else.
    • Spyrers don't have any Gang Tactic cards whatsoever. Not only they lack the teamwork they also are so novice in the underhive that they simply couln't resort any out of the box thinking.
    • If spyrers play scenario that has limitation ammount the fighters deployed at the start of the game, they deploy half the usual ammount (rounding fractions up)
    • When Bottle checks are made, substract 1 from the natural roll.
  • Hard Target: Spyrers are especially elusive and deadly foe that require immense wit, skill, and some would say luck, to put down.
    • Taking Spyrer out of action yields one extra experince point
  • Inexperienced:
    • Spyrers count as Juves for all rules and purposes
  • Power Suits: Spyrers have access to most recent technology and uses all kind of gadgets available. The suit it self is an armor, wargear and weapons. It takes a time to learn all the possibilities of the suit, but once mastered spyrer will become a formidable foe.
    • Every Spyrer suit has following items installed in it
      • Bio-Scanner
      • Respirator
      • Photo-Goggles
      • Skinblade
    • Spyrer weapons cannot be disarmed.
    • Spyrers trust their Power Suits unconditionally. Thus they will never be pinned by hit. They are pinned if they are wounded instead. (note: Compared to old rules where spyrers always could escape pinning + had rerollable initiative test, I think this is slightly better. I imagine Orrus armor simply stand in barrage of fire while the rich kid inside laughs when bullets are bouncing of the armor. Only when it penetraters even the most hardened fighter cannot control the urge to take cover)
    • Spyrer suits contains advanced medical tools. If there were no enemies on the table at the end of the game, the spyrers suffers critical injury may make a medical escort at no cost and without another gang member. Additionally spyrers can only go into the recovery if they roll critical injury on the lasting injury chart.
  • Gang Rating;
    • Spyrer team has gang rating of 200 per spyrer + value from advancements + value of power boosts. Spyrers never receive underdog bonuses
  • Rogue Spyrers
    • If spyrer team is reduced to single member it gains Rogue Spyrer bonus. Double any experience gained and Rogue Spyrer may force reroll on scenario roll.
Vow
Spyrers decent to underhive to prove apoint or simply to have fun. They don't care about territory or income in the hive. When they form their team they also make a wov and try to achieve some specific goal in the Underhive.

When Spyrer gang is formed choose one of the vows

  • Search and exterminate: Spyrers commit to kill sixenemy fighters. A kill os only counted if fighter dies for rolling death on lasting injury or spyrers capture a fighter that isn't rescued. In multiplayer game the death must be result of Spyrer action.
  • Learn your lesson: Spyrers commit to gather total 40 Experience. Add experience from dead spyrers also to the total
  • Winning is the Key: Spyrers commit to survive six fights on the underhive

Once the hunt has achieved its vow they return victoriously to the spire ready to start a new lives in the Noble House hierarchy. However, many of them develop a taste for excitement and bloodletting of the hunt that they often return to the Underhive as a part of new Hunt

When the Spyrers return to the spire all lasting injuries are removed due high tech medical attention. Spyrers can form a new team, replace their dead ones or retire old ones. You cannot choose same vow that any of the spyrers in your team has allready fullfill.

Power Boosts

Each spyrer has Power boosts that are listed on their entries. There is always three minor boost, two major boost and two ultimate boosts.

Everytime spyrer manages to fullfil half of the vow progress, during the next post-battle sequence you may pick one minor boost, for the spyrer. When Spyrer manages to fullfil their first vow and return to the spire, they can choose one major boost. And when they finish their second vow and return to the spire they can pick one ultimate boost. Each boost can only be chosen once



Gang Composition

  • Spyrer team consist of five Spyrers, no more, no less. Choose a suit for each spyrer in your gang. Spyrer cannot change their suit once it is chosen, even if they fulfil their vow and return to Underhive on another hunt they must use the same suit.
Skill Access

-------------

Power Suits

------------

Special Scenarios

Loot trap: Basic Idea is that Spyrers places a worthy loot somewhere in the hive, and the enemy gang will be ambushed. (some kind of surrounding + quick draw style first round), but if gang manage to win it it would reward lot of credits.

Tortured Captive: Basic idea is that spyrers place captured enemy fighter inside a device that slowly is killing them, while they wait for the gang to come to rescue -> ambushing them in a while. Basicly the device could be something like it does str x damage every turn to the captive where x is the turn number etc.

Change Log
  • 17.9.2018 added link to Spyrer rules v0.1
  • 4.9.2018 Made alot of changes,
  • 24.8.2018 Minor adjustments, couple typo correction, made them all champions
 
Last edited:

Loriel

Gang Hero
Nov 27, 2013
1,661
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Kangasala, Finland
Here is the first draft of the basic concepts I considered

How would you guys think of the idea about the no pinning from to hit but only after to wound. If we compare it to the old rules where they was able to escape pinning with rerollable initiative tests, I think this way done it works better for the fluff.

Additionally should they have some other gadgets on the suits

Also how rulewise would be the best. To state that all the spyrers are specialists thus gainging experience as leaders / champions etc. and buying their advancements or they are tehcnically champions.

For the suits. I was thinking that should there be little more options for them. fThis would allow spyrers to get slightly more possibility to adjust to local meta. For example having a lot of multiwound enemies, perhaps some different kind of weaponry would be nice or having a large enemy gangs some aoe etc. would be nice.
 

Punktaku

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Shouldn’t they also be Immune to Starvation (or has that been removed in N17)?

i like the idea of more characterful advances to allow more unique suits. like maybe the Orrus with enough advances can morph their gauntlet(s) into a heavy stubber or heavy bolter.

maybe a malcadon can get the ability to launch their claws (throwing spikes? spike launcher?) or they can get a version of the harlequin holofield and flip belt?

i also like the idea of new suits, but i’m thinking each should be a spyred version of a core gang... Something like

Orrus/Goliath (strength)
Jakara/Escher (agility)
Malcadon/Delaque (stealth)
Yeld/Orlock (shooting)
Altum/Van Saar (technology)
Vattra/Cawdor (rage/flames)
 
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Punktaku

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That’s ambition! it’ll at least give people something to work with since it doesn’t seem like GW will get around to it any time soon.
 

Loriel

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You are probably referring to this:
https://yaktribe.games/community/vault/infamy-and-outlaws.932/

it is a good start as of this moment it only holds rules for territory / bounty AND it introduces a new value for gang called Infamy, whichs is like opposite of reputation, which is the main way to get outlawed (I like the infamy idea alot)

Which it currently doesn't have is rules for starvation, outlaw trading post and naturally the gangs.

I personally intend to make the basic Outlaw rules rather streamlined so that they can be easily used during campaign and perhaps in the first step go for really simple trading post idea that use same trading post, BUT if you roll doubles something random happend etc.

And for starvation I think would like to have another penalty supply. (this is just the first brainstorm idea) but perhaps like upkeep is 2 for food and 2 for equiptment. and starvation means flesh wound at the start of battle and supply loss means -1 ammo roll.


BUT. as said first I would like to have the spyrers done. They are technically easier gang to make as there is little need for campaign / territory etc. consideration to be made :D
 
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Loriel

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FighterAgilityBrawnCombatCunningFerocityLeadershipShootingSavant
JakaraPrimary-Primary-Secondary-Secondary-
YeldSecondary-SecondaryPrimary--Primary-
MalcadonPrimary-SecondaryPrimarySecondary---
Orrus-PrimaryPrimary-Secondary-Secondary-
Vattra-PrimarySecondary-Primary-Secondary-
AltumSecondary--Primary--SecondaryPrimary
 
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Loriel

Gang Hero
Nov 27, 2013
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Kangasala, Finland
First draft

FighterMWSBSSTIWALDCLWllInt
Spyrer44+4+334+118+8+7+7+
Jakara+1+1---+1-+1----
Malcadon+2+1---+1-+1----
Yeld+1-+1--+1------
Orrus---+1+1--+1----
Vattra---+1+1--+1----
Altum--+1-----+1--+1
 

Loriel

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SuitEquiptmentPowerboost
JakaraSuit Armor: 4+
Monomolecular Sword. +1 str +1 ap , 2 x parry
Shield: Same as van saar shield
Laser Bracer: Count as laspistol
1. Combat Neuroware: +1 characteristic of choosing (prolly need upgrade due new experience system)
2. Sharpened Monosword: +1 str and ignores all armor
3. Improved Mirror shield: Gives shield similar mirror ability that old rules had
4. Improved Lasgauntlet: +1 str +1 ap +rapid fire
5. Improved Motive Power: +2 Movement
6. Containment Purge: Standard action once per game: Place 5 inch template over jakara. Everyone else on the templeta is hit byt STR 5 ap 2 D2 hit, whit knock back
MalcadonSuit Armor 4+
Web spinner: (should this be more like grapnel or more like the old rules of just freely doing spider man moves)
1. Combat Neuroware:
2. Claw Growth: +1 str and Parry
3. Shade Plates: BS attacks -1 to hit against Malcadon
4. Thickened Armor: +1 Armor save
5. Improved Motive Power: +2 M
6. ?
YeldSuit Armor 4+
Laser Gauntlet: Count as Lasgun
Chameleon Wings: Allows yeld to fly. Any shooting attack against yeld gets -1 to hit (basic action) Blend in, this action cannot be used if fighter has done any other basic action this turn. It turns yeld in to invisible, so it is impossible to shoot yeld. Yeld can be seen within 4 inch of the yeld. Blend breaks if yeld does any other action or is pinned / injured.
1. Combat Neuroware:
2. Laser Magnifier: Las gauntlets long range increased to 48
3. Boosted Laser Power: Laser gauntles str and ap is increased by 1
4. Enchanced Chameleon Wings: Chameleon effect causes -2 to hit
5. Improve Motive Power: +2 movement
6. Sharpened Wings: If yeld charges from upper position to close combat it gains +1 ws +1s +1 attack
OrrusSuit Armor 3+ / 6+ special save (was there some kind of reflector shield etc on the rules?)
Bolt Launcher: Range 0-8 / 8 - 16 , short +1 to hit, str 4 ap 1 d1. Twin-linked hit causes two hits instead
1. Combat Neuroware:
2. Thickened Armor: +1 armor
3. Enchanded Pistons: Orrus gain +1 str +1 t
4. Bolt Ignitors: Bolt Launcher long range is increased to 24
5. Improved Power Field: Increase field special save to 5+
6. Salvo Launch: (double action) Once per game: Make 3 shooting attacks one by one (so each of them are targeted separately)
VattraSuit Armor 3+, immune to blaze
Flamer: template etc.
1. Combat Neuroware:
2. Thickened Armor: +1 Armor
3.
4.
5.
6.
AltumSuit Armor 4+
Drone: WIPS
Spider Mines: WIPS
1. Combat Neuroware:
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
 

Loriel

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So now there is some first drafts and ideas.

One of the thing is that since armor has become common thing, I think that is the reason why spyrers have base 4+ armor. Because like orlocks have 5+ armor it shouldnt be that bad. I also though about having some randmo special rule that spyrer armors ignore one armor penetration, which is slihglty worse than just +1 armor, but overall I don't think it will pose a huge issue

I never liked idea of Jakara using shield as ranged weapon. It didn't appeal me, thus I introduced simply las pistol for some random ranged shenanigans. I don't know about the mirror ability either.

Combat neuroware also is something that probably needs reworking. Basicly with the new system where you can buy advancement for any characteristics that seems little expensive. SO perhaps it simply should be etiher possibility to go past the maximum characteristics or turn it something slghtly different. I would personally like that every spyrer would have that one ability.


for vattra and altums, i prolly go for really simple desing atleast for the time being. Using spider Bombs similar how scavvies rat bomb work and those gun servos as base for the drones.
 

Loriel

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Also should the suits have some kind of "doctor" rules written on them. As they probably would take their friends to the doctor. Perhaps extra reward if spyrer is killed like reputation equal to 1+ advancement of the spyrer for gang.
 

Ikiry0

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Mar 16, 2018
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Interesting. I'd give them all a second wound though (On par with champions, since you've basically got a gang of nothing but champions). I've been doing my own work on Spyrers, though we've taken very different tracks (I separated the suit upgrades from EXP, with 'cash' in this case being suit upgrade stuff rather than physical dosh.)
 
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Loriel

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yeah I always had a little off feeling in the old munda about power boost being a "level up" reward. (game mechanically fine thing, I don't mind that) but thematically I never though it should be that way. But it helps when they are considered rather the spyrers learning to use the suit more effectively. You might have the greatest and most expensive killing machine suits available to you, but it doesn't mean much if you are not good enough to exploit their every trick.

Also I don't want to go too far out for NCE spyrers (besides the Vattra Altum) I really like @Punktaku pointing the correlation for house gangs.

Having the extra wound wouldn't probably be too bad. Given as you said other gangs champions / leaders have extra wounds as you pointed out and total wound pool at start would be 10. And for thematically it is easy to consider that that suit would give them extra wound.

I have missed your thread https://yaktribe.games/community/threads/homebrew-gang-spyrer-hunt.7543/ but unfortunately it seems that the link to the spyrer document isn't working... I would like to see your work if
 

Ikiry0

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Mar 16, 2018
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Hmm...interesting. I can't access the document even from my google drive. It seems like there is an error that's making it not accessible right now, hopefully it will be alright in a while. That's annoying.

Something that was relevant to my own tinkering and likely to this: N17 has more shiny toys than old necromunda did, so the Spyrers are likely going to need some shiny toys of their own to really keep that elite feel.
 

Punktaku

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what if the “new” toys were actually old toys brought back?

my main thought on that is Fields. Holofields for Malcedon, Distortion Fields for Jakara (the teleporting ones), Conversion fields for Yeld (or maybe swap that with the Jakara fields) and the refractor field for the Orrus. Keeping with the fluff in development, the generators are built into the suits already, but need to be unlocked through use (experience).
 

Ikiry0

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Mar 16, 2018
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Brisbane QLD, Australia
Fields are likely a very good option. They help blunt one of the big Spyrer weaknesses 'What happens if you get shot in the face with a meltagun?'. With Van Saar having much bigger guns than before, fields would be a nice addition.
 

Graushwein

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Aug 16, 2015
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Okay, since I will probably be using these rules, I'm going all-in! I'm just now learning the rules, but am going to be giving my full participation. (I have over 10 years in technical writing, so I bring a lot of critical analysis experience and am a very strong native English writer.) That being said, let me know if I don't understand any rules. You won't hurt my feelings, and I appreciate being corrected, truly.

Also, can we please add my version of the Inferno Spyrer, in addition to the others? (Not sure what skill access it should have, yet. Stat increases should be +1 M, +1 WS, +1 Initiative.)

Okay, I have the basics down, and I'm going to offer my opinions on what I understand so far...
Leader/Champion and Activating additional Spyrers -
  • Should there be a designated leader so that 3 can be activated at once?
  • I think all guys should at least be Champions, so that at least two can be activated at once.
Independent: Spyrers are in constant communication with each other and are highly self-motivated.
  • Maybe: When a leader or Champion is activated, another ready Spyrer can be activated anywhere on the table?
  • I like the only pinned if wounded thing.
I noticed on the Orrus you substituted the WS bonus for a Toughness bonus. I totally agree.

Will do more, but about to play a game.
 

Loriel

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@Graushwein thanks for the input, It is highly appreciate!

Well thats a good point, for activating groups (that is something I personally don't like being a standard rule. Imo it kind a breaks the great thing about the alternative activation system, and IMO it should be leadership skill /special item to get ability to activate more which would be rare trick. Well like said this is only my opinion and IT IS a core rule and No i don't have intention to tinkerin with that :D)

So it is settled they are all considered to be champions. What other things does the "champion" status bring. Well post battle actions and for spyrers there are pretty much none.

I strongly dissagree with leader part. They shouldnt have leader and when they are champions, they have more possibilities to activate groups. I wouldn't go that far that they can activate groups anywhere on the board (perhaps only Altum could?) Or it would be skill from savant tree or something like that, which allows them to take activation anywhere on the field.

about the inferno spyrer: Vattra is kind of it (and for the name I prefer Vattra over inferno spyrer as it sounds more like the suit names). I imagined it more like heavy armored Orrus similar to Firebat from starcraft. where that statline would make it more agile style. But as said, it shouldn't just be Orrus with flamer, but something little different and I take you have much experience on the inferno spyrer and how it interracts, so definately lets adjust the Vattra so that it works and is nicely different to the others.

@Punktaku yeah fields definately, I will look the GW III and give them fields, definately should have such :D

@Ikiry0 that is interesting concept, having lot of options for spyrers to build. But atleast for the time being I probably stick with more simplier way of just choosing the suit. (I though about having couple options and perhaps it could be done in fashion that they have Primary weapon and Secondary Weapon. Any power boost like +1 str +1 ap would affect the primary weapon etc. etc. etc.) and for example give Orrus a shooting that either is high str high damage or morelike rapidfire small damage.


---------------

Still lot to work, and I probably get back to my real life work now, but thanks for comments.