N18 Starting Delaque gang: optimized?

[ralphinator42@gmail.]

I play in a rather competitive local meta when it comes to gaming. I preface with this as although I know necromunda does not have a reputation as a "competitive" game, my playgroup will approach it as such. I'm looking for help with a tight, optimized starting point for a campaign.

Leader. Autopistol. Mesh. Overseer.

Nacht-Gul. Serpent's Fangs. Mesh. Spring up.

Nacht-Gul. Serpent's Fangs. Mesh. Spring up.

Phantom. Plasma Gun. Mesh. Fixer.

Ghost Specialist. Long Rifle.

Shadow. Web Pistol. Mesh.

Shadow. Autopistol.

Shadow. Autopistol.

Basic hope is that I can overseer slingshot the web pistol juve early game, subsequently overseering the plasma Gun ideally, the long rifle as a back up.

I bounced back and forth between fixer or overwatch on my plasma gun phantom. I'm not sure if I'm better off keeping two Nacht-Gul or trading one for a phantom with webgun (same price).

Web pistol shadows are likely ideal for the list. Some of my first additions when possible will be gangers with lasguns, possibly a shotgun to fill out my roster. I've also heard whispering merchants for delaque are a good investment.

 

[HugeSamples]

If you're going full meta you might want to consider what your opponents are playing (if you know). i.e. if their are a lot of goliath--T4+ models--a webgun might do you better than a web pistol.

You're also going to want to pick up another gang fighter asap to hedge against one of your existing ones dying and putting you into an illegal gang comp.

You have 8 members which is the min I would feel comfortable running, so you're good there.

If you want to go full toxic NPE (negative play experience) on your phantom Take Down might give you more credit generation/harming your opponent than Fixer.

Overall it seems "fine".

 

[Heart of Storm]

It's fine, not a list I'd play against anyone I liked but fine for a "meta heavy"circuit.

Just be aware that experienced players will be prepared for Nacht Ghuls so you may have to lean very heavily on that plasma gun to break a gap for you, I think your plan for more gangers is the right investment priority, I would be leaning into an aggressive mid-close range loadout to create openings for your Nacht-Ghuls and support them / keep pressure up after they deploy so would be leaning into shotguns over lasguns myself.

 

[ralphinator42@gmail.]

My main concerns for the starting list are twofold:

Would I be better off giving my phantom overwatch?

And am I investing too heavily in Nacht-Guls at the start? Should I switch one to a phantom with infiltrate, web gun, and mesh (same credit cost) for more variety, flexibility, and support for the other Nacht-Gul?

 

[HugeSamples]

Would I be better off giving my phantom overwatch?

It's hard to say if it's "better". It's a different tool for a different job.

Fixer will generate you 240 credits on average for a 12 game campaign. More credits allows you to buy better weapons and gear, as well as help you sustain your gang with new models and trips to the doc.

Overwatch will give you more board control during the game and pairs well with Overseer.

If you want to be "that guy", Take Down can generate you credits by selling off captured models, either back to the owning player (most are willing to pay 75% value) or the guilders for 50% value. You also are taking away a model from an opponent making them weaker if you sell the captured model to the guilders.

And am I investing too heavily in Nacht-Guls at the start? Should I switch one to a phantom with infiltrate, web gun, and mesh (same credit cost) for more variety, flexibility, and support for the other Nacht-Gul?

Nacht-Ghuls pair pretty well together due to them having the ability to group activate. However, a webgun champion is very good too. Personally I'm a fan of variety so I'd lean towards the webgun phantom in this case, but since you're trying to go meta you need to consider what you'll be playing against.

Nacht-Ghuls can be tricky for both you and your opponent--too often they get used as "grenades" to take something out then promptly go out of action afterwards.

It might be a good idea to do a couple of practice games and feel out which combination of "champions" suits your playstyle better.

 

[ralphinator42@gmail.]

I think I'll stick with fixer to lessen the probability I can't afford Rangers after my first game.

And I may go for the variety. Thanks!

 

[Heart of Storm]

I would back the phantom/web gun. Your Ghuls won't be on the table first turn so your opponent will be focus firing your web pistol and/or your plasma gun, if they're successful they can then round on your Ghuls when they arrive.

Web infiltrator is on the table turn one, you can either be super aggressive and go for that turn one strike, or deploy them most the way up the table but in cover and use them as a 13" radius exclusion zone. It puts pressure on your opponent turn one and forces them to work around your models and your plan, which gets even more pressured when the Nacht Ghuls show up as then you can bring your web gun (and pistol assuming your juve made it up the table) forward as well to add threat.

 

[Aulenback]

Nacht-Ghuls can be tricky for both you and your opponent--too often they get used as "grenades" to take something out then promptly go out of action afterwards.

Yeah, and on a 4x4 table, finding good places to place those Nacht-ghuls can prove tricky. Remember it isn't >6" away OR out of line of sight of every enemy fighter, it is AND out of line of sight of every enemy model. Even on properly dense tables, we have found that can get tricky. Instead of using them to "Alpha Strike" and kill one target model and then be isolated, they can also be useful to ignore the alpha strike and hit the scenario objective, Defiling Shrines and grabbing Loot Caskets and such like. But they are expensive for that, where an infiltrating Juve could be a lot cheaper.

I think I'll stick with fixer to lessen the probability I can't afford Rangers after my first game.

Another good option for "money" security is Savvy Trader, which gives a consistent 20 credits as long as you are equipping your new hires, plus gives a bonus to your Rare Trade roll. Unlike the credits from Fixer, it can only apply to equipment from the Trading Post, but also unlike Fixer, it is a certain 20 credits, where Fixer could net you only 10 per scenario fought, despite averages.

 

[Beebopalulla]

Two nacht gul seem a bit too much if you plan on using fixer. Fixer works better the more fighter have it. So either keep it that way or more juves with fixer later in the game.

 

[ralphinator42@gmail.]

I was giving some thought to dropping my long Rifle and web pistol in order to get another plasma gunner and put a web gun on my specialist, as the long rifle feels underwhelming. The idea being that the web gunner would hang by my overseer and double plasma gunners and be used to intercept any forward team coming for my gun line, especially with the overseer being able to group activate him.

My thoughts being that a webgun on a 3+ BS models feels a bit wasteful. Am I crazy for putting such an expe sive weapon on a 1 W model?

That would leave me with this:

Leader. Autopistol. Mesh. Overseer.

Nacht-Gul. Serpent's Fangs. Mesh. Spring up.

Phantom. Plasma Gun. Mesh. Fixer.

Phantom. Plasma Gun. Mesh. Fixer.

Ghost Specialist. Web Gun. Autopistol. Mesh.

Shadow. Autopistol.

Shadow. Autopistol.

Shadow. Autopistol.

 

[HugeSamples]

Long Rifles aren't a super impressive weapon, they are a cheap S4, AP -1 weapon.

I think a webgun on a specialist is fine. I agree it does feel bad wasting a phantom's stat line on a template weapon. I'd drop the auto pistol on the specialist, they will never use it over the webgun.

I assume the idea here is an overseer plasma gunline, with a webgun to launch down the board when the time is right? Shadows are meat shields/play the objectives?

This list will probably do well, albeit a bit boring due to all the duplication.

That said if all the leader does is overseer plasma guns, it begs the question why doesn't it just have a plasma gun itself?

 

[ralphinator42@gmail.]

I had an extra 5 credits. Maybe I give it to the Nacht-Gul? Or just go with 995c and hope for an underdog bonus.

You're very right about gameplan.

The thought on the leader not having a plasma Gun is twofold. Retaining the ability to overseer/group activate combo the webgun specialist, and later web pistol Jules. Second, to make my leader an unappealing target. If my opponent decides to target my leader, they will not have accomplished much in diminishing my offensive output. It also seems like an effective route of multiplicative effectiveness for less credits.

 

[Beebopalulla]

5 credits = stub gun. A back up weapon is always nice.

 

[HugeSamples]

I had an extra 5 credits. Maybe I give it to the Nacht-Gul?

If the Nacht-Ghul is firing that auto pistol then your opponent has done something right, or you've done something wrong .

I'd bank it and/or give it to one of the plasma gunners. That said I think the plasma gunners would want a long range backup weapon like a las or auto gun.

 

[DoomMerchant]

I think starting with infiltrate webgun isnt a waste of BS3 because it is so strong for the reasons listed above. In particular not being out activated in round 1 and having more threats for your opponent to play around T1.

I like a better weapon on the leader - shotgun just because they are BS3 and you dont want to waste the credits when you cant effectively overseer. (Plasma gun cant get LOS or is out of ammo or any other thing that can happen.)

I like smoke grenades on 1 or 2 juves and cheap photo goggles on a plasma with overseer. Juves are move 6 so with a webpistol and overseer have a giant threat range (18" move + 8" template.)

Smoke gives you lots of options to control the board/los even if terrain/deployment is tough for you.

I prefer bodies to armour out the gate too because more activations can just force people to commit their power pieces while you are moving juves throwing smoke. And getting someone to commit a power piece to an inefficient turn is pretty powerful by itself.

Also, tactical options for group activations with smoke, overseer etc etc allow you to outplay your opponent which is more interesting and very powerful given the options for that style a delaque list offers a player.


I also think if you are forcing people to by photo goggles to deal with your smoke then you are much more efficient than your ultra-competitive meta boys. Or they are just stuck trying to ply around your goggles and smoke spoiling their plans...

 

[ralphinator42@gmail.]

I appreciate all of the above advice. I didn't even realize how many credits I had sunk into mesh armor until I played with the list and saw how many credits I could free up. It's a gamble but going naked at first may pay dividends. I could use the extra 5c to turn the Master's autopistol to a stubgun and dumdums.

Master. Autopistol. Overseer.

Nacht-Gul. Serpent's Fangs. Spring up.

Phantom. Plasma Gun. (Fixer? Overwatch? Takedown? Undecided.)

Phantom. Plasma Gun. (Fixer? Overwatch? Takedown? Undecided.)

Ghost Specialist. Webgun.

Shadow. Web Pistol.

Shadow. Autopistol.

Shadow. Autopistol.

995

 

[Aulenback]

Takedown

How does YOUR table play "Takedown" in the 2023 rules, given how it was written for the 2018 edition rules? The "capturing" rules have changed drastically.

 

[ralphinator42@gmail.]

Well that makes it easy! I'm still between fixer and overwatch but I think the extra credits from fixer are a good cushion so I don't end up in a downward spiral if an early game doesn't go my way.

 

[HugeSamples]

How does YOUR table play "Takedown" in the 2023 rules, given how it was written for the 2018 edition rules? The "capturing" rules have changed drastically.

That's a good point. The way I'd interpret it is: you can capture a single fighter via takedown in addition to any captured via the serious injury chart.

 

[HugeSamples]

Well that makes it easy! I'm still between fixer and overwatch but I think the extra credits from fixer are a good cushion so I don't end up in a downward spiral if an early game doesn't go my way.

Could always go one of each.