Necromunda The Sump: General hobby venting thread (Beware: old men shouting at clouds)

[spafe]

@spafe yeah, that’s the group. Although if I remember right, mr. Spiderlegs was a librarian? I think they made a pact, then rejected it to return to the Emperor, but the damage had already been done. I don’t remember them killing off the chaplains… I thought there was someone who performed chaplain duties…. But it’s been ages since I read the series too.

Just read the synopisis, he was a psyker (so probably a libarian), but also became chapter master. One of the main corruptors of the chapter was the chaplain, who was killed near the end. Basically they are an incredibly stupid chapter who made one bad call after another, stumbling from one disaster to another, and all the while being manipulated by mustache twirling villians.

But they were fun books to read for sure! and I do remember liking the show of different factions within the imperium, a lot of the plots revolved around different factions having differing goals and coming into conflict which I did enjoy

 

[Pagumb]

admittedly been a while since I read their books, but I thought they made a pact/were decieved by a demon, their chapter master embraced chaos at some point and became a spider legged monster, and they murdered their own chaplains? Or am I thinking of another chapter?

I avoided them as an example as the books were controversial from what I remember and also I thought tracked a chapter in their fall, from loyal, to renegade, to chaos.

Been awhile since I read that series too but I remember a few more nuisances…Ad Mech theft of a chapter relic, no overt embrace of chaos by the chapter but certainly by individual marines, great efforts to stabilze/revert the mutations (involving destruction and furthering their negative narrative), a chapter civil war, etc. They packed a lot into the four books.

 

[Grognard Gluefingers]

OK guys and gal, shameless plug, Part 1 of my story is done, that I mentioned above. More of a prequel than details about the Lost and the Damned force itself. It's actually inspired by my earliest teenage wargaming scenarios, with my cousin.

https://yaktribe.games/community/threads/the-necromundan-23rd-part-1-a-star-is-born.12161/

It's also a rationale for a rare type of faction leader that used to be canon in 1st edition, and was retconned out. If anyone knows and remembers them... hopefully this origin story will be a kick. I will leave it to figure out what I'm talking about from the story, and Part 2 will make it more obvious.

 

[Biggle_Bear]

Are we talking about the blood drinkers book?

That's the one with a space marine who lost his hands and instead of accepting retirement jammed two pieces of scrap in his stumps and went beserker?

That was a cool story.

That's my point about the chaos choices. They aren't space marines gone wrong. It would be hard to create the blood drinkers chapter on table. Their mutated characters need special rules. that means you need the chaos codex, but the chaos codex has raptor or khorne beserkers but not assault marines with the option of going without jet packs or having mutations.

 

[spafe]

That's my point about the chaos choices. They aren't space marines gone wrong. It would be hard to create the blood drinkers chapter on table. Their mutated characters need special rules. that means you need the chaos codex, but the chaos codex has raptor or khorne beserkers but not assault marines with the option of going without jet packs or having mutations.

I dont think I understand.

The chaos codex has raptors (assault marines with jump packs), normal marines (that have options for bolters or bolt pistols ans ccw which could easily be shown as mutations), or khorne zerkers (the ones in the story fell to khorne), which would be your elite combat troops. Jsut because they are 'khorne beserkers' doesnt mean they need to have the giant bunny ear helmets etc.

 

[MusingWarboss]

This leaves a little bit of interesting design space where there may be chapters that appear to be loyalist chapters that actually are not but also that there may be chapters that appear to be chaos chapters but are not either.

Then there’s that one weird Chaos chapter which just has loyal Space Marines still in their actual livery in, except the chapter symbols have a big red X painted across them!

Makes me think someone just wanted to paint a load of chapters and cane up with a cheeky way of using them all together!

 

[NoOneII.]

Makes me think someone just wanted to paint a load of chapters and cane up with a cheeky way of using them all together!

Kinda Reverse DeathWatch?

 

[spafe]

Then there’s that one weird Chaos chapter which just has loyal Space Marines still in their actual livery in, except the chapter symbols have a big red X painted across them!

Makes me think someone just wanted to paint a load of chapters and cane up with a cheeky way of using them all together!

part of the red corsairs. before they got their full colour scheme and fleshed out with horun blackheart as their boss etc, they had an insert in the painting guide to paint up loyalists schemes and red x them, because they were 'the' renegade warband, so the point of them was they would hoover up all other renegades and accept any marines into their forces.

Great fluff. I still have a few marines painted like that for my chaos lamentors (when they sided with them in the badab wars, putting them on the wrong side of the conflict)

 

[MusingWarboss]

Colin and Neil, who until last tuesday was just Colin with a slight mole on his neck when suddenly head No. 2 appeared and become Neil, probably won't pass muster...

I think their actual names were Michael and Alan (I am - So am I).

part of the red corsairs. before they got their full colour scheme and fleshed out with horun blackheart as their boss etc, they had an insert in the painting guide to paint up loyalists schemes and red x them, because they were 'the' renegade warband, so the point of them was they would hoover up all other renegades and accept any marines into their forces.

Great fluff. I still have a few marines painted like that for my chaos lamentors (when they sided with them in the badab wars, putting them on the wrong side of the conflict)

Yeah, that was fun to see. Gives a nice bizarre spectacle and quite the talking point.

 

[Biggle_Bear]

I dont think I understand.

The chaos codex has raptors (assault marines with jump packs), normal marines (that have options for bolters or bolt pistols ans ccw which could easily be shown as mutations), or khorne zerkers (the ones in the story fell to khorne), which would be your elite combat troops. Jsut because they are 'khorne beserkers' doesnt mean they need to have the giant bunny ear helmets etc.

I know. I shouldn't really complain about it. I should just do more research and be more innovative. It's just that I feel railroaded when something feels overly flavoured, and feel the chaos list is.

 

[MusingWarboss]

I know. I shouldn't really complain about it. I should just do more research and be more innovative. It's just that I feel railroaded when something feels overly flavoured, and feel the chaos list is.

Unfortunately this is a limitation of the Codex format.

See “House of” books for an example. They’ve really gone to town on the fluff and build fluff to the point that it’s getting much harder to imagine a gang outside of their specific niche.

The classic option is to effectively either proxy a list from another Codex or to mix up things by choosing units from a few places. This of course only works in casual settings.

In most of GW’s first editions of their games you’re given free reign to go wild with your imagination and with every subsequent version it gets tightened down and you can no longer really play outside of that list.

 

[Punktaku]

There’s always the chaos god Malal, who the other four don’t talk about (no no no). I think he wants to murder them all…?

And for the original kill team, I used all my leftover marines, painted them in random livery, then blacked out their shoulders to make them Black Guard. “Traitor” but not chaos. They reject the ecclesiarcy.

 

[Gunkaiser]

Isn't the Corpse God basically Malal at this point?

 

[MusingWarboss]

Was pretty pleased to see the six old 90s era Space Marine Captains coming to “Made to Order”. Used to have 3 of them, sadly traded away decades ago. (Why did we do such silly things. Hoarding for life!!)

Well here’s my opportunity to get them back! Those classic 3 (Wolfhead, Dark Angel, Baldy) and the powerfist guy I always wanted, a chance to paint up some old classics again in brand new casts, not someone’s decades old paint encrusted chipped and damaged eBay jobs...

*Goes to GWs website, locates the Captains*

TWENTY-ONE POUNDS A F***ING MODEL!!!

Are you serious GW? I assume they’d be expensive but somehow I just failed to assume they’d put them up Soooooo high.

I’m not sure what prices I’d expected to be honest, like £10 a model (which is still pricy but in line with eBay) but not ForgeWorld Resin price level.

So, £84 for the four I like... err, nope.
I’ll slowly sift through the dregs of fleaBay and see if I can snag them over time, hopefully not encrusted or looking like they’ve spent the last few decades rumbling around in a toolbox.

 

[Stoof]

I always wanted the powerfist guy, but likewise immediately gave up on that idea the moment I saw the price. Not a chance.

They're potentially more expensive as they will come with ye olde space marine backpack sprue as well, and GW isn't going to chuck in that for free when they can make you pay through the teeth, are they? The current MTO Eldar are still at the "normal" £18 for--one-model Forge World gouge-level.

It's not even that long ago I paid £20 for a whole squad of MTO Steel Legion.

 

[cronevald]

Seeing that $35 US price, should I feel bad that I once sawed off the bald guy's bionic leg for a conversion?

 

[MusingWarboss]

They're potentially more expensive as they will come with ye olde space marine backpack sprue as well, and GW isn't going to chuck in that for free when they can make you pay through the teeth, are they?

Indeed! If you’re as suspicious of GW as I am (unlikely I know) you’d check the description of what you actually get!!

Why?? Well, 4 of those are photographed without the old metal backpack-cape. They all originally came with the metal cape in the 90s, so let’s see...

My findings? The two Angels are shown with a cape and they are listed as “This finely detailed metal miniature comes in two components, and is supplied with a Citadel 32mm Round base”
So is the metal backpack enclosed? I’d assume it is as it’s pictured with it.

The others say: “This finely detailed miniature comes in two components – a metal miniature and a plastic backpack with banner pole. It is supplied with a Citadel 32mm Round base.”

Except Mr Wolf Head who says: “This finely detailed miniature comes in two components – a metal miniature and a plastic backpack. It is supplied with a Citadel 32mm Round base.”
So it’s debatable whether he even gets a banner pole!

They’re all £21. So there you go. Never forget that GW will shaft you at every opportunity.

 

[spafe]

They all originally came with the metal cape in the 90s, so let’s see...

I dont believe the wolf head one came with, although never bought it so going from memory. The powerfist and the bionic leg ones, when I bought them (later 90's or early 2000s) did not come with metal backpacks with capes (it is possible they might have once, but were repackaged by the time I bought them).

The Ultramaine captain pointing a sword... I've still got in the loft in his blister, I thought he came with a metal backpack but can check later in the week. the Dark angel one definetly did (I have mine from early 2000s that I repainted few months ago on the shelf behind me), and still does. no idea on the blood angel, but as it comes with a metal one, I assume it did before.

But yes, at 21 quid, thats out of my price range. I bought the tyranic vets, cassius, blood angel apoc and the space wolf termie from the last made to order round (and am now painting a ultramarine army as a result), but they were 15 quid per model at most which I was okay with. This is too much for even the 'oh that would be nice and I'm even doing the army now' feeling to want to pick them up

 

[MusingWarboss]

I dont believe the wolf head one came with, although never bought it so going from memory.

He did, I brought him in 94 and he had one. He’s also shown with one in the 40k 2nd Ed Rulebook in the colour pages just before Psychology.

Ironically the Dark Angel in that same section has no backpack at all!!

I also had the Dark Angel Captain (brought around 93) and he came with one as did Bald chap with bionic leg. A mate had the Blood Angel around the same time and he also had one.
But yeah, they all came with one as it was the Space Marine Captain Backpack.

No doubt they probably did phase them out to a basic plastic one with banner pole in later years but I wouldn’t know when.

Weird though that this selection seems to be a mix? I just wonder if wolfy here comes with a plastic modern wolf backpack?

 

[Punktaku]

I had the Captain with terminator honors and Baldy Bionica. They both had the metal cape. They’re only $35 US each. That’s ridiculous.