Necromunda The Sump: General hobby venting thread (Beware: old men shouting at clouds)

[Lord_Ikka]

While GW does seem to historically pin its prices to inflation levels (for the UK at least, everybody else gets hit with their random, ridiculous shipping/currancy charge), they don't seem to realize that pinning their prices to inflation fails to take into account wage increases, or lack thereof. They are a hobby/disposable income producer, rather than a staple like food/electricity/water provider, and people don't see the same value in something keeping at the same "level" as previous years while their wages haven't increased by the same amount.

Yeah, its great that a box of [insert whatever troop here] is $X and that is the same price relative to inflation that it was 20 years ago, but all wages didn't go up the same 2.4 times per year that the inflation did. Putting yourself out there as the most expensive product on the market, especially in terms of what is required to purchase to field something like a tournament-standard 40k army, is a bad move in my view. It will catch up with them eventually, and it almost did already when FFG had the X-wing license and had risen to number 2 in the tabletop world (then eventually crashing and burning for a couple of reasons). With stuff like 3d printing on the rise and companies like Wargames Atlantic/Mantic/AMG and games like Star Wars Legion/Shatterpoint/ASOIAF becoming more popular, GW is going to have to face a pretty sharp decision on how they want to really face the future. They haven't really shown the will/skill to transition their products to the online world in regards to great functioning apps/electronic rulebooks (for the main games).

 

[MusingWarboss]

GW prices have largely tracked inflation, and in most cases you're getting a superior product these days. It's not quite exact because RPI doesn't necessarily track luxury items like toy soldiers, but if you bung prices into an inflation calculator for 'standard' boxes they largely come out the same.

It's a shame UK wages have largely stagnated for the last ~16 years but that's a political conversation to be had another time.

As gets mentioned later, that’s a bad thing as wages don’t cover what they did.

Do you remember when lightbulbs cost very little but burnt 60-100w to run? Modern bulbs are more expensive to buy but use significantly less power - a better product in many people’s eyes - yet people are still struggling to pay power bills.

How did we all manage to sit around under 60-100w bulbs all night in the 80s? Because even basic wages covered that power cost, plus those bulbs actually contributed to keeping your house warm too.

Why am I talking about lightbulbs? Because it’s a lightbulb!! It has the same exact purpose then as it does now, whether it’s an old filament, halogen or LED.

Likewise a modern marine dreadnaught today costs around £40. Sure it’s plastic, comes in a big box with lots of accessories and is bigger but realistically it fulfills the same exact role as the 80s metal one, which originally cost £5 and was in a blister.

For me the prices are also slightly psychological, much like the price of a PC game is £30ish right? and has been since I worked in GAME in the late 90’s! I think you feel you should get at least a couple of models for a £5 regardless of inflation.

There is a psychological level to this I’m sure. I don’t think it helps having grown up in the era of the cooler, high quality models being in metal and the chaff and filler was in plastic.

Metal felt like a premium material, even if it was a bit worse to work with (most of the time you didn’t need to chop them up though) and plastic was the cheapo option.

Now everything is plastic, which is easier to work with, the detail is crisper and it’s less likely to damage BUT the prices put them in premium+ range.

Just can’t shake the feeling that ‘this is a plastic model kit, it should be mass produced’.

Putting yourself out there as the most expensive product on the market, especially in terms of what is required to purchase to field something like a tournament-standard 40k army, is a bad move in my view.

But also bear in mind their rules nonsense which I mentioned earlier. This was considered 2000pts in the 90s:

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Orks fare a little worse being a horde army:

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Then along came 3rd edition and halved the points value just as they sold you 16 plastic models in a box - making them the equivalent to 8 old metals in game but for more upfront cash.

 

[Tiktaalik]

There are some great posts here. I had a decent childhood in the states and was lucky to be able to get stuck in the hobby like I did. Now that I am a parent though, i will probably steer clear of buying only new models all the time. Buying pre-owned is not as glamorous as cracking open the newest kit, but it is in line with the rest of our family values around consumerism, plastic waste, emissions etc.

 

[Troubled Child]

much like the price of a PC game is £30ish right?

Oh my sweet summer child, more like £60 or £70 on release now.

 

[Condottiero Magno]

Oh my sweet summer child, more like £60 or £70 on release now.

I forgot how expensive UK PC and console games were compared with prices in the US. In most nowadays, one doesn't "own" the game, but downloads it into their library and there's the possibility of losing access if the ToS is violated or an account hack. I remember when games were in proper boxes and came with manuals that some didn't read. I think I still have the Mechwarrior 2 Mercenaries manual, as it had some interesting bits of lore. Nowadays, patches are easier to obtain compared to then, when one didn't have internet access or relied on dial-up.

 

[Condottiero Magno]

There are some great posts here. I had a decent childhood in the states and was lucky to be able to get stuck in the hobby like I did. Now that I am a parent though, i will probably steer clear of buying only new models all the time. Buying pre-owned is not as glamorous as cracking open the newest kit, but it is in line with the rest of our family values around consumerism, plastic waste, emissions etc.

I don't seem to hold in the same regard used plastic as used metal. Looking at eBay, the prices asked for assembled AoS plastic figures is almost as much as those new on srpue and they're covered in mold lines that are now difficult to access. The glue on metal could be dissolved, but a plastic figure/kit will have to be cut apart if assembled with poly cement/plastic glue - so much for the claim that plastic is easier to clean up.

 

[Stoof]

In most nowadays, one doesn't "own" the game, but downloads it into their library and there's the possibility of losing access if the ToS is violated or an account hack.

Actually owning stuff that you've paid for is so 1990s, as I was told by a spritely young coworker when I was talking about high prices on second hand cars these days. She couldn't fathom why I wouldn't just lease one for £400-500 a month...

 

[ClockworkOrange]

You buy them at full price? Lol that’s why Supreme Leader Gabe invented Steam sales!

Oh my sweet summer child, more like £60 or £70 on release

 

[Tiktaalik]

I don't seem to hold in the same regard used plastic as used metal. Looking at eBay, the prices asked for assembled AoS plastic figures is almost as much as those new on srpue and they're covered in mold lines that are now difficult to access. The glue on metal could be dissolved, but a plastic figure/kit will have to be cut apart if assembled with poly cement/plastic glue - so much for the claim that plastic is easier to clean up.

Used plastic is IMO a bad deal for exactly the reasons you described. Maybe if I was an AOS tournament player who couldnt care less about mould lines or whatnot, but I have my sights set on middlehammer metal

 

[Troubled Child]

You buy them at full price? Lol that’s why Supreme Leader Gabe invented Steam sales!

One or two in the past 15 years or so but generally I wait for sales. The buggy mess that many games are on launch doesn't inspire people not to wait but, just like with GW, there are too many people who appear to have a lifetime ticket for the hype train to encourage any sense of best practice on the part of developers. Thanks to friends who got super into humble bundles I also have a digital pile of shame made up of games I've never even installed.

I forgot how expensive UK PC and console games were compared with prices in the US.

We do indeed suffer reverse GW pricing in that regard.

 

[ClockworkOrange]

@Troubled Child I’ve largely managed to kick the habit but there was a time I maintained 3 Steam libraries due to being lucky enough to have 3 Lan PC’s in my basement. That said I recently got an Xbox X with game pass, for the kids obviously , and Starfield and Balders Gate 3* have tried to pull me back in.

*yeah I dont want to talk about the £65 price tag!

 

[Troubled Child]

Balders Gate 3* have tried to pull me back in.

*yeah I dont want to talk about the £65 price tag!

My understanding of the game is it's mostly about setting up barrels in advance of combat and then casting one spell to win any fight.

 

[Wasteland]

I recently installed again Icewind Dale Enhanced Edition and finished the first chapter with my skimpy Amazons. It´s good to be a vintage gamer.

 

[MedMos]

I've played the crap out of Baldurs Gate 1 and 2! And quite a bit of Icewind Dale, though it didn't draw me in as much. These days I'm mostly playing Civ4, when I get the chance to sit down by my ancient laptop.

 

[ClockworkOrange]

Balders Gate 3 deserves all the praise it gets truly awesome game that’s absorbed a good 100 plus hours.

 

[Greyhart]

So.. female Custodes.

<sighs>

I'm NOT going to get into it because my blood pressure will skyrocket, which will piss off my doctor.

All I'm going to say is that this is the last straw for me and the entire GW brand. Added on top of product shortages, distribution problems, removal of entire product lines, etc, etc, etc I am finally and completely done with GW forevermore.

I should have learned my lesson before when I got out of GW's clutches but I got pulled back in by a friend (now much to his embarrassment) and wanted to give them a second chance. Everyone in my book deserves a second chance for the most part.

You don't get a third. Three strikes, you're out. And so am I.

Tons of other games and companies out there where I don't have to put up with crap and can just enjoy the games. I'll be spending my money there thank you.

 

[ClockworkOrange]

Just caught up on a Reddit thread, the Trolls too old to understand why this is important to people, it’s a fantasy grim dark future after all….

That said probably for the best if we don’t discuss it here, people will have very strong feelings about it either way.

 

[Punktaku]

Could make for a nice up-armored Escher leader.

 

[Stoof]

I only vaguely know what a Custode is* - largely ignoring "new" lore for the win!

(*40k equivalent to Sigmarines, themselves the AoS equivalent of Space Marines? That right? It's come full circle!)

 

[TopsyKretts]

Yeah I don't have much respect for custodes, male or female. They sneaked in when I left GW/40k to play other games. Felt like yet another top layer of "best of the best" guys.